Sovietwarplanes

Hi,
I'm tracing a drawing of this UIL-2

(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/il-2/il2-camo/uil2-n8zemun.jpg)
On the 4+ monograph, there is a color profile of the same plane with a Guards mark on thee right side of the tail, but it doesn't appear on this photo.

(http://img.wp.scn.ru/camms/ar/264/pics/1_70.jpg)Do anyone knows if there is another photo showing the plane with that mark?

Regards
Massimo

Since "special" markings such as personal markings and slogans often appeared only on the port side, if the Guards emblem appeared on the starboard side, it should have appeared on the port side also.  Absent photographic evidence, which I have been unable so far to find in my collection, I would say that this aeroplane did not have the Guards emblem.

Regards,

Jason

Hi Jason,
to tell the truth, there is a vague dot that could vaguely resemble a guard's mark, but should the central starlet have a white background, it should be as evident as the white border of the large star, and it isn't so. Do you know if that mark existed without the white background too?
Regards
Massimo

I wouldn't think so.  If they're trying to copy the Guards badge, it should have the white.  I actually have a Guards badge, and the centre is filled with white enamel.  I think the white's too conspicuous a part of the emblem for it to be omitted.

Regards,

Jason

Another thing: is it possible that a training unit was made Guards?
Regards
Massimo

No, it was the other way around:  a guards unit tasked with training!!!

You have correctly identified this UIl-2 as Yugoslav, so check what Wikipedia says at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/421st_Assault_Aviation_Regiment

The 421st Assault Aviation Regiment was established on December 20, 1944, in Laćarak, from Yugoslav partisan aviators with the Soviet Air Force 17th Air Army's 165th Guards Assault Aviation Regiment (165.GShAP). It has become independent form Soviet command and personal since May 1945. Regiment was part of 42nd Aviation Assault Division, it was equipped with Soviet Il-2 Shturmovik ground-attack aircraft. Regiment has took part in final operations for liberation of Yugoslavia. During the combat operations it was based at Laćarak, Krnje?evci, Zemun, Nadalj, Bački Brestovac and Sombor airfields.

Few Yugoslav Il-2s had Guards sign, most didn't...

Regards,
KL

Hi Konstantin,
thank you for the information, so there is really the possibility that the plane had the mark, if it's possible to find it without the white background.
Regards
Massimo

UIl-2 No 8 didn't have Guards sign on the port side of its tailfin.

(http://www.mycity-military.com/imgs/18848_42406344_Trenazni%20UIL-2%20sa%20duplim%20komandama%20sprema%20se%20da%20na%20prvi%20let%20ponese%20naseg%20pilota%2C%20centar%20za%20preobuku%20Zemun%20decembar%201944.jpg)

Yugoslav Il-2s with the Guards sign (on cockpit canopy)
(http://www.mycity-military.com/imgs/18848_43782850_il2.jpg)
(http://www.mycity-military.com/imgs/18848_72339716_IL-2%20422.%20puka%20snimljen%20po%20dolasku%20na%20a.%20Pleso%201945..jpg)

Hth,
KL

Thank you Konstantin, excellent photos indeed.
Regards
Massimo

Hi,
this topic is interesting as a reference for Yugoslav Il-2s.
http://www.mycity-military.com/Vojna-istorija/Il-2-Leteci-tenk.html (http://www.mycity-military.com/Vojna-istorija/Il-2-Leteci-tenk.html)
There are lots of profiles of Soviet ones, although obsolete, and a good color photo of Korean Il-10.
Regards
Massimo

Owner of those photos is Mr. Milan Micevski, photos and text were posted there with his permission.  Mr. Micevski is the leading authority on Yugoslav aviation history and expert for Yaks and Ils in general.  He is author/coauthor of several books on Yugoslav aviation history and author of many articles published in Yugoslav/Serbian aviation magazines.

Following photos are kindly provided by Mr. Micevski:

(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm13/klesnikov/Yugoslav_AF/UIL-2_centar_za_preobuku_Zemun_Dec_1944.jpg)
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm13/klesnikov/Yugoslav_AF/UIl-2_Prva_grupa_jugoslovenskih_pilota_centar_za_preobuku_Zemun_Dec_1944.jpg)
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm13/klesnikov/Yugoslav_AF/UIl-2_No8_Zemun_Dec_1944_crop.jpg)
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm13/klesnikov/Yugoslav_AF/UIL-2_centar_za_preobuku_Zemun_Jan_1945.jpg)

Very good photos! Thanks to you and Mr. Micevski!
Regards
Massimo

I found the book on line that shows the profile in question. The book has some interesting information in it none the less.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/44258880/ILYUSHIN-Il-2-Shturmovik-From-www-jgokey-com

Hi Barneybolac,
this book is excellent, even if it considers the late versions of Il-2 only.
Regards
Massimo

I believe the brown is way off both on profiles and Czech restored example...

You're correct.  AMT-1 Light Brown was actually a tan colour, which originally had more grey to it but became more tannish as the war went on.  The AMT-12 Dark Grey is also wrong on the profiles and the Prague-Kbely restored example - it should be much darker, approaching almost black according to some sources.  The patterns are correct, though, and correspond to the NKAP templates.

Regards,

Jason

Hi,
from wartime photos, it looks that the brown on the metallic part of the fuselage was darker than on the rear fuselage. I don't know if this is due to the different paint, or to the method of application, or to the heat of the engine.
Regards
Massimo