Sovietwarplanes

This is my ICM LaGG-3, just finished with the decals. I should have sourced some aftermarket decals... these ICM decals were just awful. Next up will be some more weathering, and the fiddly bits, and a flat coat!

(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-mQp6Y6kxsKU/UT6EQm3m-tI/AAAAAAAAMzg/RhJb_fVMDPc/s1000/DSC02677.JPG)

(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-3gzVf5OCwHc/UT6ERLREXwI/AAAAAAAAMzo/pwESeErOECw/s1000/DSC02678.JPG)

(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-k6DRBXPdBFE/UT6ER4ExyZI/AAAAAAAAMzw/cb_mvI1AnYs/s1000/DSC02679.JPG)

(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-mjorRz-BYvs/UT6ESXWPUjI/AAAAAAAAMz8/t4bGK7rbjAY/s1000/DSC02680.JPG)

Leonid Galchenko's aeroplane!  Very nice - I have one in 1/72nd scale that's almost finished.

Regards,

Jason

Looks very nice! I am very interested to see it completed.
Regards
Massimo

Good work John! You go! :D
I have also the ICM kit, but my molding is not so good. The frame by the rear window is not, eh, there... :(
I have not decided witch variant of Galchenko's plane i wil make.
The decals are bad with this kit. They seem to fall a part... I have AML decals ''red devils with rockets part 1''. All Galchenko's variants are on it.

Regards,

Remco

Thanks everyone!

And thanks for the tip on those decals, Remco... I'll have to find that set for future builds.

I like that alot. :D
So you use XF-81 from Tamiya for the green?
A very good representation for the black is Nato Black from Tamiya which I always use.

That's just propping the model up! :D Actually, I used XF-58 Olive Green and XF-69 Nato Black. The lighter green was a mix of the olive green and yellow until it was to TLAR standard. (That Looks About Right!  ;D)

It looks dark now because of the gloss coat. When I apply a matt coat later it will look different.

Model looks nice in this complex 4-colour scheme (dark green-light green-black+white), but it's quite unlikely that all four colours appeared on the real plane.
Why two greens, dark and light?  What would be the purpose of two similar colours? What paints were used on the real plane?

It may look as a dogma, but officially:
1.  From 1941 to 1943 there was only one camouflage scheme:  black - green
2.  From 1941 to 1945 there was only one green camouflage colour:  4BO

Hey KL,

Thanks for the kind words! :)

To be honest, I'm not very particular about being 100% accurate. If I find some good photos or drawings, I will try to make it look like that, but I don't really try to duplicate the real thing completely. I'm not a good enough modeler to do that! LOL

In this case, I found several differing color profiles, as well as some photos. The photos were, of course, black and white, but they did give me some clues to the tail pattern and how the white was applied. I actually found the profiles on this site (see below) and thought they looked nice, so I tried to get a look similar to those.

For me, modeling is strictly a hobby, and my motto is "build it like a kid". :) I figure at my age, I have enough problems with diabetes, kids in college, bill payments, etc., to worry about my models. I do enjoy the research, and I love learning new things, but often I just go with what I think looks kind of nice. :)

But I'm always willing to learn new information and apply it to the next build. I build 25-30 kits a year, so I get lots of chances to apply what I learn over time!

(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/galachenko/galachenko1pl.jpg)

(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/galachenko/galachenko1pr.jpg)

(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/galachenko/galachenko1above.jpg)

@Jonbius
You build 35 models a year? :o
And with that finesse? :o
Then I only had to build 2 years and my stash was gone. :D

25-30, yes. :) I like to build. LOL I got back in to the hobby in 2006, and since that time I've completed 151 models, 53 of which have been Spitfires! (Can you guess what my favorite airplane is? ;) ) The last few years I've built quite a lot. I build almost entirely OOB, and with whatever paints are on-hand, and I do have a fun time with it.

And thank you for your kind words!

By the way, I just ordered some Akan paints, so I'll see how those work out. I'm looking forward to trying them.

Hi Jon,
so you have a lot of models to photograph. I would like to see some of them.
Regards
Massimo

Sure! I'd be honored. I upload most photos I take to Picasa. Some aren't modeling photos, but most are. I think I have 90% of my builds uploaded there.

http://www.picasaweb.com/jonbius

Whow, I'm impressed. All the models are very well built and painted. To make such models in two weeks each is a great result. You will need a museum to store all them.
Regards
Massimo

Thank you so much for your kind and encouraging words!  :D

Looking good! Yeah, ICM decals aren't great - next time, get yourself some Microscale Liquid Decal Film and give them one or even two coats of that before you cut them out and soak them.

John

Thanks John! I'll keep that in mind, though I will probably try to source some aftermarket decals anyway!

You're welcome! Under the circumstances (you finish lots of models, I finish almost none), I'm embarrassed to offer advice, but there are aftermarket decals out there which aren't any more durable than the ICM kit decals, so the Liquid Decal Film could still be useful.

John

There are some great models you've made. It's when using aftermarket sets that it will slow down the build.
But even OOTB 35 models a year is stunning. :o

Thanks for the kind words! I do tend to stay away from aftermarket, both for the time savings and the cost. Though if I find good resin parts that are one-for-one replacements, I may use them if they're affordable.

Haha! I know exactly what you mean, when you talk about aftermarket sets. I have a Sukhoi Su-33 convertion kit for the Academy
Su-27... That wil be a time consuming project  ::). Currently i am busy to paint the cockpit of my MiG. Keep up the good work here!

Regards,

Remco

She's done. Good kit. Get aftermarket decals though if you decide to build it. The ICM kit decals are beyond horrible.

(http://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-gbJkwRiM9z8/UUepRhdf8kI/AAAAAAAAM1k/QcvvPRvXy18/s1000/DSC02686.JPG)

(http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-3jZEBLHREPk/UUepTZoDahI/AAAAAAAAM18/ZVizajKGVs4/s1000/DSC02689.JPG)

(http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Vih4NSofilg/UUepUa3lSsI/AAAAAAAAM2M/Zb6ZtTgWyYQ/s1000/DSC02691.JPG)

(http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-bH_xk-TeEaY/UUepU20bDLI/AAAAAAAAM2U/lcbSJIBXg3E/s1000/DSC02692.JPG)

(http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-J9bBCZhTP2c/UUepV3uRLVI/AAAAAAAAM2k/ER04GifUARY/s1000/DSC02694.JPG)

(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-069EJdQBamc/UUepXLXHMVI/AAAAAAAAM2s/p0EoL0W6WEs/s1000/DSC02695.JPG)

Hey John!
Your LaGG looks great! Nice job  :D
The ICM decals are horrible, i read a lot of bad things about it...

Hi Jon,
beautiful model indeed. The weathering is well convincing too.
you write that the ICM decals are horrible... because they break while positioning them? Maybe you could make them stronger them with a bit of Future on the sheet...
Regards
Massimo

Astonishing model. :o
You did the weathering perfect.
And how fast. :o

Thanks for the kind words everyone!

Good idea, Massimo. I'll know to do so in the future (pun intended :) ) if I use ICM decals again. I actually did use it as a surface prep, putting a small "puddle" of it on the model, and then using a cotton bud to force out the excess. It really pulled the decal down and held it in place, and I haven't had any silvering, thankfully.

Wow - nothing much I can add to what's already been said - beautiful model and great weathering job! A fine tribute to the pilot, L. Galchenko.

John

I'll add to the consensus, Jon, beautiful model and excellent job on the weathering!  Regarding decals breaking apart, to forestall that I spray a clearcoat on them before I use just about any decals, just as a precaution.  I use Testors Model Masters Sealer for Metalizer but I suspect Future would work as well.  It seems to work - Authentic Decals have a nice set of Il-2 two-seater decals, but they are fragile.  I used the sealer on them and now they work fine.

Regards,

Jason 

Overall a nice model:  4 stars (out of 5)

Plus:
-  Realistic weathering/aging/dirt + grime (great job!)

Minuses:
-  Fictional green/dark green camouflage scheme
-  There should have been more white on wings (those two bands are not convincing)
-  Missing spinner red star

(http://www.rumvi.com/products/ebook/%D0%B8%D1%81%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%B1%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B8-%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B9-%D0%B0%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BA%D1%83%D1%8E-/3d99a1cc-eef8-4f9f-bea3-c7e6f6389181/preview/i_044.jpg)

Keep on with good job!
Cheers,
KL

Thanks everyone!


Doh! I knew I forgot something! I do have that decal!

Oh well, so it's 99% finished. :)

KL, did you mean the two white bands aren't convincing in their color, or their pattern? I tried to follow Massimo's pattern for that, though I did find some speculative pattern's another model builder used in a similar build. However, he admitted it was speculation on his part. I also tried to imagine how it would have looked if it had started to wear off a bit, so I tried to simulate that.

I did find some photos that clarified the pattern on the tail. I actually considered doing a similar pattern on the wings, but thought that perhaps Massimo's pattern was based on photos I didn't find. (So it's your fault Massimo!  :P ;D :D)

If you have photos of the pattern on the wing please do share!  :) I try to collect as many photos as I can! (Thanks for posting the one of the spinner.... its is duly saved to my hard drive.)

I had a lot of fun on the weathering, that is for sure. I was very happy with how it turned out. Thanks again everyone for the kind remarks. I plan to do another of these this year!

That you received 4 stars of 5 by KL means that you did a very good job. ;D

Pattern is Massimo's speculation.  Another model builder (Misos) have tried to make an "educated guess" based on cmouflage practices - better than pure speculation.
I don't know of any conclusive photos - the best available on the internet is:

(http://jpegshare.net/images/78/cc/78cc51ba86e5466aa55bb03db2291d53.jpg)

 ;D Indeed!


That is a great photo- that is what I used to help with the tail pattern. I also found the video that was from- very cool also. I wish I spoke Russian so I could understand it! :)

I think I may have seen Misos work- perhaps I should have followed that... maybe I need to build another! LOL Why not, the first one was certainly enjoyable.

I notice the photo at the bottom center of that series has a different pattern. Is that a different aircraft, or just at a different time? I wondered that when I first saw it.

Hi,


The pattern on the wings is obtained from this photo, where you can see fresh black paints. The one on the fuselage has the exact shape of the white one, so it is clear that they were repainted black in the spring 1942.

(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/galachenko/galachenkoallm2r.jpg)


I have appreciated very much the research of Misos, that has found screenshots that were not available when the page was made. But his work is based on images, not on 'educated guesses' based on 'camouflage practises', else he could have drawn the plane with overall white uppersurfaces as commonly done in winter 1941/42.

So, my work is based on all the informations available to me, and where the informations are missing I rely on my common sense. The same common sense that suggests that a Pe-2 can't be camouflaged with yellow and black unless they want to hide it between giant bees.

Regards
Massimo

Hi Jon,
The plane shows victory stars and the later type of exhaust stacks similar to those on MiG-3. Another photo of it, without the winter camo, is available on my page. It is unclear if it's the same plane repaired with different pieces, or another plane painted to match the previous one. I suppose that the shot was of winter 1942/43.
Regards
Massimo

Hi Jonbius,

I like the overall appearance of your kit very much - I somehow preffer dirty Matt surface.
However, I am not sure it is appropriate for this particular plane. The AII Green seems to be too bright, at least what I see on my monitor. IMHO such look would be much better for some La-5 painted black/green (AMT-4) during dusty summer.
Photos show that this Galchenko's plane was quite clean and at least semiglossy. Stars on the undersurface were smaller than standard ones.

Of course, neither my interpretation is true carved to the stone - left side is from winter 41/42 and right side is from winter 42/43. If interested you can find more info at http://sovietwarplanes.com/board/index.php?topic=1445.0 (http://sovietwarplanes.com/board/index.php?topic=1445.0)
I used AML Decals without any problems.

I am really curious for your another kit. Your LaGG-3 is an inspiration for my started Yak-1 (now waiting somewhere in the box for the right moment)  ;)
Happy modelling.

     66misos

Thanks for the kind words, 66misos!

I'm a bit "odd" in how I build. I don't always try to duplicate the exact airplane. Most of the time I try to do something similar, but then apply things that are my own "style" and preferences. Partly because I'm not a good enough modeler to duplicat ethe real thing with much accuracy! LOL

I just sort of mixed the green myself, so I did not go to great lengths to get it accurate. I have recently ordered some Akan paints, so hopefully those will make it easier to be closer to accurate. And I am just learning about VVS colors in WWII, so hopefully with everyone's help I will get better! :D

And thank you for sharing that thread on the discussion of this plane- very interesting to read! I'll make notes from that for future reference.

What Yak-1 are you building? I have the Modelsvit Yak-1 partially built. The fuselage has an awful warp- the horizontal stabilizer is probably twisted 10 degrees to one side. I did not notice until I had the fuselage together and the wings on. I built the Accurate Miniatures Yak-1 many years ago, too. I need to do another one.

Thanks again for your kind comments!

"Fresh black" ="White winter camouflage" is clear and makes sense only to you.  It's nothing more than a guess.

It is clear that the tailplane was camouflaged in white during the 1941/42 winter
(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/galachenko/gala-win2.jpg)

It is also clear that tailplane wasn't repainted in black in spring 1942
(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/galachenko/gala-him1.jpg)

It's also a well known fact that white winter paint was washable with warm water.  Whoever washed that tailplane did a good job - factory number is still visible on the elevator.  If tailplane was washed, why not wings?  If tailplane was camouflaged in white, why not repeating white camouflage pattern on wings?

Two white bands on wings make plane more visible - that is how trainers were marked in Soviet flight schools.  In other words, plane with two white bands is not camouflaged...

Misos made an effort to learn about/understand winter camouflage; you limited your interpretation on available photos.

Regards,
KL

Perhaps. But the opposite is a guess too.
of course
This is wrong. There are wide parts of the tail where you can see the reflex of the pilot and of the vertical stabilizer, and other ones where you can't. Perhaps part of the repainting was green, but the most of the part was repainted.
No, it is well known that the white paint was difficult to remove and ruined the underlying paint. For example, here is the photo of Mironov's plane
(http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/lagg3/mironov/mironov3r.jpg)
We distinguish remains of white paint on the nose and the weathered rectangle about the number, while a wide part of the rear fuselage was repainted.
About the number -it looks visible, and suggests only that the relative part of the elevator preserved the original color.  The large photo shows even the reflected image of the legs of the cat on a part of the elevator.

Two straight white bands are an identification mark on any ground without snow. Any number of white irregular bands are camouflaging on a snowy background. The enemy can't count the white bands if he has not already seen the plane.

The problem is not if this plane had one more or less white band. Where not visible on photos, they are merely guessed anyway.



Here you are splitting venom between two members that haven't reasons of disagree (if not on a pair of white blotches). Should Misos have any problem with me, he can resolve easily simply speaking.
But you can't create them by putting us one against the other.
The problem is your unfair way to do.  We welcome good researchers and appreciate discussion on the painting, but haven't any need to create friction between members.

Regards
Massimo

Hi KL, Hi Massimo,

seems discussion has got again on the thin ice. I react because you both mentioned me in your posts. I very appreciate KL's opinion about my approach rearding Galchenko's plane but the personal conflict with any member of this site is the last thing I would want.
Massimo, do not worry I have no problem with you, I do no see/feel any venom. ;)

Sometimes I am also surprised with tone of discussions but I always try to see to goal of such tough discussions - to get as close as possible to the truth in particular subject matter.

Hi Jonbius,
I have Yak-1 from SouthFront in 1:48, but I am not still so far as you, just main parts separated from the farmes and cockpit partially assembled, nothing painted yet. But before I want to finish my winter La-5 "Red 58".

Regards,
     66misos

Hi Misos,

Well written, I was sure of it and I fully agree. I would like to discuss on planes and colors to add new knowledges too, but it is so unpleasant that someone makes personal distinctions about presumed differences in method.

Regards
Massimo

It's impossible to make it like the real aircraft. It's plastic modeling for God's sake!
We've got to counter scale effects and stuff like that.
If you try to make it 100% like a real aircraft you end up with AMS. :D
It must be still enjoyable.
I find your model stunning even if a color isn't 100% or even it isn't glossy or matt enough.
It's like you said. Everyone has his own style. I don't like clean aircraft. Even well maintained aircraft has weathering.

And weathering helps cover up my mistakes!   ;D

When I first started building models again, in 2006, I started to get a bad case of AMS. Modeling got frustrating for me. So I changed my mindset. Now I build with the motto "Build it like a kid!" I'm having fun. I try to make it look good, too, but all while having fun.

And I did get the decal on the spinner KL! :) I'll get some photos of that when I get home tonight. Thanks again for reminding me!

Please, gentlemen - try to keep it civil. We all have "hot buttons", but let's please keep them locked out. It's uncomfortable for newcomers to see arguments which seem to support some people's idea that VVS colours are a subject for conflict. Thank you!

John

Hi Jonbius,
could you, please, briefly describe how you achieved such a wonderfully dirty and weathered surface? :o  As I already wrote I like it very much.

You wrote you are 99% finished before small red star is applied on the propeller spinner.
And what about those two white curves painted on the left window behind canopy? ;) It is on Massimo's profile and I saw it also in some doc film, unfortunately I did not make a screenshot of it.

Regards,
     66misos

Hi Jonbius,

I got that screenshot:

(http://i1063.photobucket.com/albums/t518/66misos/LaGG-3/120710_Kabinazlava-Dec41_zps4b2c483f.jpg)

    66misos

Thanks for that photo 66misos!

I've been thinking about how to add that. I'm not sure if I should try to paint it by hand, or mask it.

Thanks you for your kind words regarding my weathering. Someone else had asked about that in a PM, so here is what I wrote to them with a few additions. Please let me know if I can clarify anything.

Here are the steps I used on this kit:

- First I painted all of the base colors on the top and bottom surfaces.
- I then used a diluted solution of white craft paint to hand paint the winter camo
- After that dried, I used a very thin solution of Tamiya white to airbrush over the hand-painted portions of the winter camo to blend them in a bit
- Once that was dry, I used a method similar to the "dot filter" method used in armor modeling, using white and raw umber oils. Working a section at a time on the model, I gave it a light coat of turpenoid, an then applied small dots of both oils paints to the surface in a random pattern. Next, I used a large soft brush to streak them back on the wings, and up and down on the fuselage. The brush was lightly moistened with turpenoid. I continued this process until I thought it looked like I wanted.
- Once that dried, I made a very thin solution of turpenoid and burnt umber, and using a large brush with stiff bristles, I "splattered" the mixture on the underside of the aircraft. I did this by moistening the brush in the turpenoid/oil solution, and then "flicking" it using the edge of a thin metal plate to rake the brush against. I kept applying this until I thought it looked right. I tried to make sure and concentrate some stains where the tires would throw mud on takeoffs and landings, and where the engine would spray oil.
- Then I gave the model a coat of Future and let it dry overnight.
- Applied decals, then another coat of Future.
- I gave the model a panel line wash of burnt umber and turpenoid (I forgot to add this step in my original PM!)
- I made a very diluted mixture of 91% alcohol and a few drops of Tamiya XF-55 Deck Tan. I airbrushed this on in a very random pattern, swirling around the airbrush in loops, lines, circles, etc., almost as if "scribbling" like a child would with a crayon. The intent is to get a somewhat dirty, faded but random pattern to break up the monocromatic look further. I did this all over- across panel lines, etc., NOT just in the middle of panels. Reasoning there is paint fades/ gets dirty everywhere, not just in the middle of a panel.
- Next I made a very thin solution of 3 parts XF-69 NATO Black with 1 part XF-9 Hull Red. Using this thin mixture, I post-shaded the panel lines. It should be thin enough that it takes 2 or 3 passes before it shows.
- I used the same mixture to add/enhance the various oil streaks and stains, as well as using it for exhaust stains.
- I then used a Prismacolor Silver pencil to add a few paint chip areas on metal parts
- Final step was to add a coat of Vallejo Matt Varnish to flatten the whole thing out. I prefer my models dead flat, with no gloss. (Just personal taste really...)

On this aircraft, I wanted a heavier appearance. Sometimes I try to imagine the airplane as may have looked even if there are no photos. A photo represents one point in time. I often like to take some artistic license and think how it may have looked after much use, or maybe after some maintenance to a certain area, or maybe even how it looked before it was very weathered.

Basically, because I build so many kits per year, I have many opportunities to experiment with my weathering technique. I generally use the same basic techniques as described above, though I may vary the order.

Sometimes I may also do an additional step in the initial painting process. I'll paint the base coat, and then apply tints and shades of the basecoat to break up the monochromatic look, and then overspray it all with a thinned dilution of the original color. This works well on aircraft with a single color on top and bottom, or if the camo pattern is masked off. (For this LaGG-3 I did freehand camo.) An example of this is a P-51 I did recently in RAAF markings. For this one, I tried to get a more sun-faded look to the paint, but not quite as dirty overall.

(http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-dQ38MhLnJ6U/UKlN0W29-LI/AAAAAAAAJdA/6hg7LMsAhls/s1000/DSC02170.JPG)

If you are interested, you can see more photos of that P-51 here: http://goo.gl/Gojdw (as well as most of my model photos)

Each model is a slightly different adventure, depending on my mood. The methods above are my basic "toolkit", but how I use them- to what degree, and in what order- may vary slightly depending on the effect I am trying to achieve, or if I'm experimenting with a new variation or technique.

The splatter method I used is something I have only recently begun doing, as I thought my models lacked some evidence of mud, dirt, etc., that would naturally be present when flying from unimproved airstrips in varying weather conditions. I've actually been considering building an F4U-1A Corsair from the South Pacific area specifically to try some very heavy weathering techniques that will (hopefully) simulate the weather extremes those aircraft faced.

It's always an evolving process- but it's fun! :)

Hi Jonbius,
I am impressed. I saw also other your kits on your page, really very nice.

Regarding:
let me describe my freehand approach with the sharp brush (not very sophisticated):
- several deep breaths,
- stop breathing,
- several training attempts on the paper,
- still without breathing and still with rhythm in my hand painting on the kit,
- a few drops of sweat on the forehead, really deep breath and it is!  ;D

Regards,
     66misos

I always do my camo free airbrushing. It's merely practice and practice.
@Jonbius
Thanks for the explanation. :D

You should have it memorized by now! LOL

No breathing! I'll pass out! :D

Hi Jon,
thank you for the exhaustive explanation and compliments for the excellent result.
A question: do you use this technique with turpentine on acrylic paints, isn't it? I suppose it can't be safely utilized on an enamel base.
Regards
Massimo

Thanks for bringing that up- I should have made mention of it.

I do use acrylics 100% of the time... well, except for NMF finishes, which I rarely do. So the turpenoid does not create any problems with the underlying paints. I've used this technique over Tamiya, Pollyscale, Vallejo, Humbrol acrylics, Model Master Acryl, and Xtracrylix.

I do have friends who have reported using the technique over enamels that have been coats with Future. However, because the surface is "slick" or smooth, the effects do do "grip" as well. The benefit of doing this over acrylics with no gloss coat is that the surface creates some tension, and the effects don't just wipe off.

It might be worth investigating, if you use enamels, to coat them with an acrylic flat coat, and test how that works. That might be a solution.

Hi Jon,


the suggestion of the matt acrylic looks very reasonable. It worths a try.
Recently I've utilized a wash with a mix of turpentine, black paint and Humbrol matt clear   over some tanks painted with acrylics, with good subcess. The Humbrol matt is used  to avoid that black pigments divide into small particles before the turpentine dries. It can be carefully washed away on protruding or flat parts with a brush with a minimal amount of turpentine on it, and gives the impression of a shadow.
Eventually I can try agan with oils, but I suppose that they are longer to dry.
Regards
Massimo

Actually, the oils are thinned so much that there is very little pigment in them. I can put them on, and as soon as the turpenoid is dried up (within half an hour) I can begin work on subsequent layers. Because they are so thinned out, they dry to a workable state very quickly. I push the envelope of drying times as far as I can to see just how quickly things can be done. I've been amazed at how far you can push it! :)

Konstantin, two questions: 1. How does your second statement above relate to AMT-4/A-24? I should have thought that AMT-4 was the principal green camouflage color during that time period, although I understand that 4BO was a commercial brand name.

2: Were late version MiGs being produced late enough to be factory painted AMT-4 (A-24)/AMT-6?

Pip

1.  4BO was developed in 1937-38.
AMT-4 nitro paint and A-24 oil paint were developed in 1941 as 4BO equivalents.  AMT-4 and A-24 were used on planes, 4BO was used on tanks, artillery, etc.

2.  so far nothing about this in available sources....  :-X

Hi
Yes, the AMT-4/6 camo was introduced exactly the day of the war outbreak. The MiG-3 was produced up to December 1941.  It is likely that they had stocks of earlier AII green to use, but it's likely also that they ended soon.
Eventually, it is likely that they continued to use AII light blue instead of AMT-7 on many planes. I would guess from photos if to use AII blue or AMT-7.  Photos seem to show that the color of the rear fuselage was darker than other parts, although this is difficult to explain and don't seem confirmed from photos of Finnish exhibits (painted before the war).
Regards
Massimo

Thanks, Massimo! I've still got one ICM kit in the stash ... sometime.
Pip

It realy depends when AMT paints were introduced during MiG-3 production.
MiG-3 was victim of the evacuation to the East.  It was made in one factory only (Moscov Factory No 1) Factory No1 was evacuated in Oct 1941 and then swithed to Il-2 production.
The peak of MiG-3 production was in July, August and September 1941 when about 50% of 3200 MiG-3s were made.  In last 3 months of the production only few hundreds MiG-3s were made.


AMT-7 was introduced in 1942, too late for series MiG-3s.

HTH,
KL

Would this also be true for at least some of the early production ("razorback") Yak-1s?

Pip

Yes. It is also true for LaGG-3s made in 1941 and sometimes in 1942.
KL