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Title: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on June 10, 2014, 02:35:44 PM Hi,
I've received some highly interesting photos from Antti Lappalainen, Conservation Assistant of Finnish Air Force Museum. (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_1.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_2.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_3.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_4.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_5.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_6.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_7.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_8.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_9.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_10.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_11.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_12.jpg) Regards Massimo Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: KL on June 10, 2014, 06:55:11 PM My thanks to Mr. Lappalainen. Excellent photos!!!
Photos of the interior are especially useful. What are the plans for this MiG-3? Are they going to restore it or just to display preserved parts? Regards, KL Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: B_Realistic on June 10, 2014, 08:26:27 PM Fantastic. :D
Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: tinleeds on June 10, 2014, 09:52:13 PM Thank you very much Massimo! Is this colour chart is FS?
Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on June 10, 2014, 10:21:36 PM Hi,
Quote What are the plans for this MiG-3? Are they going to restore it or just to display preserved parts? I think to display spare parts. The most of the metallic parts are missing, at least I think.Quote Thank you very much Massimo! Is this colour chart is FS? Yes, it is FS. He wrote that there aren't exact matches. The colors of the number on the rudder are particularly interesting. The dark red of the 1 is widely chipped, probably they used some paint that doesn't adhere too well on the nitro. The blue-green is more preserved. I think to see that the nitro paint was lost on the lower part of the rudder, that is metallic. Seems that there is not zinc chromate here. I'll ask to be sure. Regards Massimo Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: xan on June 11, 2014, 08:34:29 PM Waouh!!!
it's AIIz and AII blue? it's the first time I see AII blue... I imagined those paints more glossy (time done his work i imagine) So interior blue is the same that downside color Iam working in a I-16. It have to be the same blue in the interior isn't it. Could the interior colour be blue before june oooof 1940 ? Xan Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: learstang on June 11, 2014, 08:47:37 PM From what I see on my computer, 3(2)4097 (for AII Z - AII Green) and 25414 (for AII sv.gol. - AII Blue) seem to be almost exact matches for the present colours on those MiG-3 parts. Hard to tell how much they've changed over time, though. Any thoughts, anyone?
Regards, Jason Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: KL on June 11, 2014, 08:59:46 PM it's AIIz and AII blue? it's the first time I see AII blue... I imagined those paints more glossy (time done his work i imagine) Those are 1940-41 AII Protective Green and AII Light Blue. Somewhat different than colours used before. So interior blue is the same that downside color Iam working in a I-16. It have to be the same blue in the interior isn't it. Could the interior colour be blue before june oooof 1940 ? Clearly the metal panel is light blue, most likely A-18f. Panel is most likely in factory colours, so this could be considered as the standard interior colour for Zavod 1 in 1940-41. I would hesitate to extend this as a standard for other factories... Light blue as an interior colour during the 1937-1940 period is extremely unlikely - it wasn't used for undersides, it probably wasn't produced... Regards, KL Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: xan on June 11, 2014, 09:06:16 PM I agree with you Jason, but for the green other ref are possible too.
In the first pic we can even see a diference of tonality between AII greeen and A-19f in the metal part who is lighter Xan Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: learstang on June 11, 2014, 09:10:10 PM Xan, you can see that difference even in GPW photographs. The wooden parts appear darker. Apparently the AII Z darkened with age, and the A-19f Green didn't (or maybe the AII Z didn't fade, and the A-19f did).
Regards, Jason Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: otto on June 12, 2014, 07:06:00 PM Great pictures indeed! Too late to improve the accuracy of my MiG-3: everything is closed now. :-\
Very interesting is the green rear cockpit bay with natural wood radio compartment. Canopy frames seem to me gray: A-14? But the connecting frame between the fuselage and the rear canopy is green as the fuselage surrounding. It seems to me it shows a certain accuracy in finishing the aircraft. Perhaps, this could have been changed on wartime-built airframes? Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on June 12, 2014, 10:02:50 PM Hi Otto, hi all,
here are some notes from Antti that answer to some questions: Quote About the varnished wood, I think the laquer has pigmented, with raw or burnt umber perhaps. The wooden parts are little reddish, not pure natural. It's easier to brush the laquer if it's a little bit pigmented, you can see where the layer is thick enough. The preserved side panel really is a little bit lighter shade of green than the wooden part. I can't say is it because the yellow primer putty underneath the green surface paint on the wooden parts, because of thicker layer of paint on the wooden parts and/or thinner layer on metallic parts. The metallic parts of the rudder didn't got zinc chromate, there were patches of repair paint, but it was also chipped. No underside blue visible on the rudder. The red paint on the rudder was chipped and a quite dark shade. The metallic inner structure of the canopy was grey anodized metal, no paint at all. Unfortunately we don't have much other parts of the fuselage. At the Vesivehmaa is an elevator from 2171 and a wing, but I'm not sure is it from this particular MiG-3 or from another individual. The MiG-3 is going to an exhibition at the Anti-Aircraft Museum at Tuusula. They are going to display it "as is". Regards Massimo Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: John Thompson on June 13, 2014, 01:03:21 AM Xan, you can see that difference even in GPW photographs. The wooden parts appear darker. Apparently the AII Z darkened with age, and the A-19f Green didn't (or maybe the AII Z didn't fade, and the A-19f did). Regards, Jason Like this? (courtesy of KL): (http://s16.postimg.org/4beg7lsap/Mi_G_3_Akan_colours.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/4beg7lsap/) John Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: learstang on June 13, 2014, 06:01:51 PM Yes, John, exactly!
Regards, Jason Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: AnttiL on June 13, 2014, 09:28:37 PM Hello!
Nice to hear that my photos are helpful. If you have any questions regarding this MiG-3, I'll try to answer to the best of my knowledge. Best Regards, Antti Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: AC26 on June 13, 2014, 10:11:15 PM Nice to hear that my photos are helpful. If you have any questions regarding this MiG-3, I'll try to answer to the best of my knowledge. Hi Antti!Would the tail feathers from Vesivehmaa also added to the Hyryl? display? Cheers, AC26 Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: AnttiL on June 13, 2014, 10:32:02 PM Nice to hear that my photos are helpful. If you have any questions regarding this MiG-3, I'll try to answer to the best of my knowledge. Hi Antti!Would the tail feathers from Vesivehmaa also added to the Hyryl? display? Cheers, AC26 I hope so, it would be best if all the parts were in the same place, than spread out all over. Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: learstang on June 14, 2014, 01:07:47 AM Thank you very much for the photographs, Antti! We discuss VVS colours all the time, so it's great to see some well-preserved examples of them. Welcome to the site!
Best Regards, Jason Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on June 14, 2014, 07:09:36 AM Hi Antti,
welcome here! Your photos of these parts are a major success here. I've often thought that joining these parts with the metallic ones found in Russia it would be possible to obtain a nearly complete plane for museal exposition. Regards Massimo Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: xan on June 14, 2014, 08:36:33 AM Hello Antti,
thanks for those wonderfull pics. for the AIIz if we compare with that piece of I-16 we con see we are in the same shade of colours; perhaps the I-16 piece is more green, better conserved, and the piece seems to be wet.... the I-16 is a type 27 found in 2013 ; 650 type 29 have been produced, 80 of them in 1941, so it can be AMT-4... (http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/929508139471435191.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_1.jpg) (http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/mig3/finnishmuseum-AnttiLappalainen/mig3_10.jpg) Xan Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: AnttiL on June 14, 2014, 03:50:24 PM Thank you!
Personally I haven't done any research considering VVS colours, we have lot to do even with Finnish colours :) It's very interesting and I'm starting to build a MiG-3 scale model, so this information is very welcome. I'll try to photograph more of russian objects we have in our museum storage, when I have time. We have also original preserved rudder from R-5 and of course a Polikarpov U-2. Antti Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on June 14, 2014, 06:22:34 PM Hi Xan,
I don't think that the color of I-16 or MiG-3 is AMT-4. The MiG was built in early 1941 and painted according to standards of 1940. The piece of I-16 doesn't show a zinc chromate background, so it's unlikely that it's a nitro paint as AMT-4, else it would have been much more chipped as the green on the lower part of the rudder of the MiG-3. Regards Massimo Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: KL on June 14, 2014, 08:18:40 PM I don't think that the color of I-16 or MiG-3 is AMT-4. The MiG was built in early 1941 and painted according to standards of 1940. The piece of I-16 doesn't show a zinc chromate background, so it's unlikely that it's a nitro paint as AMT-4 Hi Xan & Massimo, I agree with Massimo, both MiG-3 and that I-16 are prewar planes painted according to May 1940 camouflage scheme. Green paint on metal parts is most likely A-19f. Its colour was 4BO olive green, same as later AMT-4. The only difference is that A19f was glossy while AMT-4 was flat (matte). They were probably pigmented with different pigments, but that is not important for modellers. Regards, KL Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on February 03, 2021, 07:07:33 PM Hi all,
I have uploaded some photos of the MiG-3 fuselage preserved in Finland at http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/mig3/finland.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/mig3/finland.html). The photos, and some notes, are kindly sent by Antti Kotiranta (Antti_K) and are in the second part of the linked page, after the older ones. Here is one: (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/mig3/fotofinnishdepotAntti_K/Reare_fuselage_interior.jpg) and some notes from him: Quote The rear fuselage is interesting as it is made out of (possibly) pine tree ribs and bulkheads and covered with plywood, most likely made out of birch tree. Inner surface is then covered with a clear lacquer that is applied with a poor quality brush. And the lacquer wasn’t used sparingly! The coat is very thick; especially in every corner, which make them look orange coloured. Also the brush strokes are visible. Title: Re: Photos of MiG-3 fuselage stored in Finnish Museum from Post by: Massimo Tessitori on March 14, 2021, 07:24:22 PM Hi,
there is a topic on the preserved pieces of MiG-3 in Finland and the downed plane at https://www.flightforum.fi/topic/48751-mig-3-punainen-ykk%C3%B6nen/ (https://www.flightforum.fi/topic/48751-mig-3-punainen-ykk%C3%B6nen/) Information from Tapani Tuomanen. Regards Massimo |