Sovietwarplanes

Hi all,
I've uploaded two pages with profiles and photos of two interesting La-5s.
One is a rare example of an early production La-5 with operative markings:
http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5early/240iap.htm (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5early/240iap.htm)
(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5early/early24rpr.jpg)


the other one is a standard La-5, but with very interesting markings:
http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/la5-57of164iap/la5-57of164iap.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/la5-57of164iap/la5-57of164iap.html)
(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/la5-57of164iap/La5-57%20of164iap-lpr.jpg)

Regards
Massimo

Hi Massimo,
Thanks for this research on early La-5. One more to add to my VVS project.
Regards
Bernard

Hi Bernard,
I'm very interested to see your projects becoming real. Thank you for sharing your experiences.
Regards
Massimo

Hi Massimo, La-5 variant. At one time, i made profile on the plane “23” Leutinant Patoka, 240 IAP. With colleagues discussed and corrected. If you allow, a few comments? ..
I marked in orange those places that can be corrected.
Unfortunately, the working version of my vision is motivated, due to the lack of a conclusive version at hand.
(https://i.postimg.cc/kGpyJ0yb/early24rpr.jpg)

Hi,
you are right, the camouflage has to be corrected.
It is visible on this photo too.
(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5early/240iap4.jpg)
Seems that the black band has to be fully separed from the wing area by a green one arriving down to the blue area.
I see that some minor corrections are needed on the mid and rear fuselage too.
Could you send an intact version of the photo, please? It is new for me.
Regards
Massimo

Hi,
I've done it.
(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5early/early24rprm.jpg)
There is some small difference between the plane of your photo and n.24.
Regards
Massimo

And still, this is purely my personal opinion, but if you look at the "hero's star" and the inscription - it seems to me that the inscription "Baumantsy" has yellow color, and the inscription "To Hero Lukyanov" is mixed yellow and red paint ...

(https://i.postimg.cc/F1mcxdGs/151.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/F1mcxdGs)

(https://i.postimg.cc/zVGg9s9s/152.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zVGg9s9s)

(https://i.postimg.cc/Th9bNdHj/153.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Th9bNdHj)

(https://i.postimg.cc/crknZDWr/154.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/crknZDWr)

Thank you very much!
Regards
Massimo

Yes especially not for that)))

Hi,
I've made a quick photo composition.
(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5early/total-r.jpg)
Regards
Massimo

Awesome. Can i take this collage?

Hi,
do you need an higher resolution version? It is not a perfect work though.
I am wondering if the look can be improved by expanding the photo on the vertical axis. I've the impression that it is somehow slim.
Regards
Massimo

Massimo, wait. First, let me give these photos without compression ..

1280Х800

(https://i.postimg.cc/VdVJxvqM/151.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/VdVJxvqM)

(https://i.postimg.cc/Nyh50nPj/152.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Nyh50nPj)

(https://i.postimg.cc/4KznH1rb/153.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4KznH1rb)

Hi,
I've extended the image on the vertical axis and I've updated it on the site, but seems that  the forum still shows tho old one. I think that there is some problem with cache memory. I often had to modify the names of the images to see them updated.
The image is blurried, there is no adventage to redo the work with an higher resolution. Anyway I have an higher resolution version if you need, but there is no advantage in it.
If you want to show the photo, please do, just credit it as usual.
Regards
Massimo

Hi all,
I've added a profile of a La-5 n.26

http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/grey26/grey26.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/grey26/grey26.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/grey26/grey26-lpr.jpg)

The profile was obtained from this photo.

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/26grey.jpg)

I don't know the unit or the place; I can guess that it was of the 4 GIAP KBF in winter 1943/44, somewhere not too far from Leningrad.

Regards
Massimo

Hi,
a new update:
http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/piercedheart/piercedheart..html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/piercedheart/piercedheart..html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/piercedheart/piercedheart-rpr.jpg)

At the end, La-5s are less boring of what I thought.

Regards
Massimo

Excellent job a rare find as well.

Beautiful job on that very interesting La-5, Massimo!

Best Regards,

Jason

Thank you. I love this plane.
Regards
Massimo

I do to. I already have two built-up 'razorback' La-5s, but I might have to add a third one with this paint scheme.

Best Regards,

Jason

Two kits of Zvezda you mean, or 1/72?
Regards
Massimo

Massimo, they were two 1/72nd scale kits (I only do 1/72nd scale now). They are the same kit (same plastic), but one was under the Cooperativa brand, with PE parts, and the other was in an Eastern Express box, without the PE parts. A nice kit, with only the cowling giving me a bit of a problem with the fit. One was done as that famous version with the big shark mouth on it, whilst the other was done as one of the 'Valeriy Chkalov' La-5s. I've developed quite a liking for the razorback La-5s - I might just do another, especially if I do it as this very interesting La-5 you've drawn. Regarding the silver in place of the white for winter camouflage, weren't there some P-39s painted with this?

Best Regards,

Jason

Hi Jason,
I have one Cooperativa one left half built some years ago. The plastic was badly brittle, but it shouldn't be difficult to restart and complete it.  I have a Zvezda too, one day I'll start to build some 48s.
Regards
Massimo

Interesting that you mention about the brittle plastic, Massimo - the plastic on my Cooperativa kit was brittle also. It was done in a brittle brown plastic, the type that MPM used to use (I believe MPM and Cooperativa were related in some way). I don't remember the Eastern Express kit having brittle plastic, and I built that relatively recently - in the past five years or so. The Cooperativa 'shark-mouth' was built over twenty years ago.

Best Regards,

Jason

I made the Coopertiva one a long time ago, bought in late 1993 made in 1944.  I think perhaps an early release, but it was in a green plastic and not particularly brittle.

Hi Massimo,
If you continue to add such interesting profiles, I will be obliged to buy new kits  ;)
 For sure, I will make this one and  the "early" Baumancy
La 5 1/72, either Cooperativa/Eastern express or AML are not easy to find.
Best regards
Bernard

Hi Bernard,
I have still some profiles, but not so particularly interesting. All depends on the available photos, and unusually painted La-5s are.... unusual.
Regards
Massimo

Be patient for a little longer - the new La-5 and La-5F kits from KP are finally supposed to be released late this year.

John

That's nice to hear, John. I've been waiting for those for quite some time. That, and their La-7. Looks like I'll have some more kits to add to my ever-growing set of Lavochkin fighter kits.

Best Regards,

Jason

Hi,
another update.

http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/91/91.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/91/91.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/91/91lpr.jpg)

This is a transition plane of summer 1943, with the old camo, stars and back, but new engine M-82F and later fonts of the number.

Regards
Massimo

Hi,
could anyone translate the brief text on this address, relative to the silver La-5 please?
http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/img_1507266_1538325814_bez-imeni20180930192112.jpg.html (http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/img_1507266_1538325814_bez-imeni20180930192112.jpg.html)
Regards
Massimo

Hi,
I've uploaded a profile of the famous La-5 of Kostylev (he flew it once...) at
http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/sharkmouth/sharkmouth..html

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/sharkmouth/sharkmouth15lpr.jpg)

Regards
Massimo

Hi,
a further addition about 159 IAP:
http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/18red/18red.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/18red/18red.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/18red/18red.jpg)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/18red/10of159iap.jpg)

Note the absence of red stars on the fuselage, and the characteristic fonts of this unit at the time.

Regards
Massimo

Thank you!

Google translation.

https://beta-static.photobucket.com/images/af142/barneybolac/10/217b7494-549f-4a60-9d63-fc3ea35770d1-original.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds

Thank you. I wonder if this text could be related to another plane.
Regards
Massimo

Dear Massimo,
   as you suspect the information is for the following airplane:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/47093257104_4ab01dac34_b.jpg)
The inscriptions are "За Гальченко!" with a large "З" superimposed to "Горьковскому пожарному", so it a plane donated by firefighters, and with a dedication, an eagle and a couple of stars.
   About the “silver” plane, it comes from M.Yu. Bykov, who says it is in a factory applied gloss white, as was in use in winter 42/43, unit unknown.
   What appears as a white stripe on the rudder is said to be a light effect.
   About the heart, it is presumed yellow / orange, the arrow black, the trimmer either black or minium.
   Dmitry Novikov thinks instead that it is silver, with pale red spinner, star and tail number, with a green heart and black or dark red arrow.
   Well, who knows, but these are really colorful planes!
Regards
Daniele

Hi Daniele,
thank you for the answer. I remembered to have seen something relative to this plane some days ago. If I understood well, they thought that there is an inscription Eskadrilya Valeriy Chkalowon the other side.
They supposed that the iscription Za Galchenko was made with chalk for photo purposes only, isn't it?

About the (supposedly) silver plane, I agree that the apparently white part on the tail was due to reflection only. I considered that the heart could have been green with reference to the German Grunherz, but the photo shows it black, while any green should have been lighter, more or less as the red star.
Regards
Massimo

Hi Daniele, hi all,
this link shows the reconstruction of plane 18 made by Kazakov.
Here there is the photo of another plane 2x with the same slogan of firefighters, and a document that suggests that it should have the inscription VCh on the other side.
https://avk-tehnik.livejournal.com/23075.html?utm_medium=email&utm_source=GuessWhoBack

The origin of the photo seems to be here:
https://zaika70.livejournal.com/29073.html (https://zaika70.livejournal.com/29073.html)
There is something written on this Galchenko, that, if I understand well, wasn't the famous ace but another pilot kia.


Regards
Massimo

Thank you Massimo!
   A really beautiful plane.
Regards
Daniele

Hi Daniele,
yes, it is nice, I am drawing it according to the interpretation of Kazakov.
A new thing is that the inscription VCh is not necessarily associated to the farmers of Gorki.  Orlov himself (Owl99) declared that this is a new information.
Regards
Massimo

Hi Massimo,
A lot of modellers will be disapointed, like me,  to learn that it's a decoration for museum . So,  I will not use it.
Fortunately, you propose a lot of other sketches for La 5.

Best regards

Hi Bernard,
I agree, this subtracts a lot to the interest of this machine.
Regards
Massimo

Very nice La-5s, Massimo!

Best Regards,

Jason

Thank you Jason.
I've made a pair of updates:
http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/18zagalchenko/18%20zagalchenko.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/18zagalchenko/18%20zagalchenko.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/18zagalchenko/chkalov18rpr.jpg)

and

http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/wide42/wide42.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/wide42/wide42.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/wide42/chkalov42wideBlpr.jpg)

and some marginal updates to the VCh page.

Regards
Massimo

Some updates about La-5s

http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/15of193iap/15of193iap.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/15of193iap/15of193iap.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/15of193iap/15of193iap-lpr.jpg)


This one was obtained by increasing the contrast of a photo that seemed to show a plane without numbers:


http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/61/61.html (http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/61/61.html)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/chkalov/61/chkalov61-lpr.jpg)

Regards
Massimo

Cool. I very interested in 193 iap, where the photos come from?

BTW, 1942 may be a typo?

Hi Vlad,
both photos are shown at pag.14-15 of the Czech monograph La-5 of Milos vestsik, MBI. There is a Russian edition too.
The caption at pag 15 says that the photo is of July 1943, Skorodnoye airfield. Yes, 42 was a typo, I've corrected it, thank you.
The other photo is at pag 14; it doesn't say the unit, but the plane and its markings are identical to n.15.
Regards
Massimo

Hi all,
new photos of the plane with the pierced heart have emerged:
https://zaika70.livejournal.com/tag/%D0%9B%D0%B0-5 (https://zaika70.livejournal.com/tag/%D0%9B%D0%B0-5)

(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/piercedheart/piercedheart-rpr.jpg)
the profile will require some correction, particularly on the supposed band on the lower surface, that now looks more as a patch on the side surface.
Regards
Massimo

Hi,
I've updated the page and the drawing.
(http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/la5/piercedheart/piercedheart-rprm.jpg)
I've changed a bit the proportions of the heart, modified the small rectangle into a retouch, and made red areas on the tail. Of course I can't be sure that they are red, but they have to be glossy if they change their look in each photo.
Regards
Massimo

That's a beautiful La-5, Massimo, very distinctive! Regarding the outline for the tail, being a Soviet aircraft, red's as good a guess as any. On a Russian FaceBook page I saw a profile of an Il-2 that was supposedly at Stalingrad; it was shown with a yellow spinner. I reminded them that was unlikely, as having a yellow spinner, at least in that part of the war, was asking to be shot at by the Soviets. I believe it was Aleksandr Pokryshkin who wrote that when he saw yellow, he fired.

Best Regards,

Jason

Hi Massimo

great that more images have turned up,  (I PM Massimo about this a while back)

I'm still inclined to think the '14' is red, i can't see any tonal difference,  and suspect that blue would not stand out enough against the silver, while red would.

I am so happy though that more and more great and unusual images are appearing on Russian sites,  always a treat to to come here and find more new images.

I'm very much with Jason about seeing profiles with yellow markings,  it really does not make sense.
cheers
T

Hi Jason and Troy,
yes, it is nice but I still have doubts on it.
Apart for the color of the number, I wondered if the thing appearing on the top of the rudder and stabilizer could have been the shadow of the small tail mast, but the main mast doesn't project any noticeable shadow, so I rejected the idea.

Regards
Massimo

For those who are interested,  here are links to more images of the 'Baumantsy' airplanes
https://goskatalog.ru/portal/?fbclid=IwAR2ee7YlhaYrUvsofPjBcQp4Tk_Sm1_ASY0kGXZUL_CcZ0nn0JPXfOi8x_A#/collections?id=27245820
https://goskatalog.ru/portal/?fbclid=IwAR0g9kQ4KIApWlTZYg8IMCkeUQC9PnDwq0m5VT0QCaHv_IJ2sdHcwQVjhek#/collections?id=27245830
https://goskatalog.ru/portal/?fbclid=IwAR2bR3ZH0aB5UNtYpNmjKu4BJmGvV4vWn3-q25cPMU6I0ocXBk93xZiXhQA#/collections?id=27244936
https://goskatalog.ru/portal/?fbclid=IwAR3ohaObl20E3Dt31agW53EQRQabDhuL2PDIxN2tDAtyAMd_OQdhjlANj_E#/collections?id=27244960

Hi Anton, thank you for the link.
There is also a nice detail confirming that Lavochkins of that age still had a light instrument panel.
Regards
Massimo

Good spotting Massimo! it looks light,  true:)
By the way,  I have done some research/profiles on the Baumancy planes.  I have tried to attach pictures in this post, but couldn't figure out how,  so here is a link to the page if you'd like to have a look:) All the info I found about these planes is there,  and I've put a link to your page there too, hope it's ok.

https://www.planesinprofile.com/lavochkin-la-5/baumantsy/patoka/white-23

Hi Anton,
I've read your excellent page and left a comment. It is all very well made.
To attach figures, one has to load them in another site (your one for example), copy and glue the photo address, select it and push the second button of the lower row, the one with the picture.

About the colors of the cockpit, the available photos of Lagg-3 seem to show silver painted sides, and I suppose that this could be true for La-5s too, at least the early ones. I suppose that the light color of the instrument panel is AE-9 light grey. I don't know the color of the floor, and am uncertain on other details. Have you other informations or impressions on this?

Best regards
Massimo

Thanks so much Massimo! You are too kind:) I really appreciate the compliment coming from someone like yourself.  It really means a lot. So thanks again:)
Massimo, I haven't done much research on the interior.  The first thing I'd do is go to SovietWarPlanes.com to find out! lol
But  to try and answer the question,  I have seen a reconstruction of a La-5 built in Novosibirsk -  They have gone for the green floor/blue sides, which makes sense. On another note, I believe that Kozhedub's La-7's interior has grey floor and seat,  and the dashboard is black, Maybe some later La-5s were also painted the same? not 100% sure.  (by the way,
 thanks for the tip on how to attach images) (https://static.ngs.ru/news/2020/99/preview/12ddaf21bfb5c045515404bf2970b1ad1994338e_960_640_c.JPG.webp-portal)
The image is from here: https://ngs.ru/text/gorod/2020/08/31/69449845/

Hi Anton, thank you very much for the link, I didn't know of this work in progress. The rebuilt plane looks amazing.
Green floor and seat are a possibility for a plane of 1940-42, no doubt. Even light blue is a possibility, but I think to see the way to reflect the light of aluminum paint in the photos of the sidewalls of the LaGG-3. 
I think that the painting of insides was unified in late 1942 or 1943, so I would have painted the cockpit of the La-5FN as the plane of Kozhedub in medium grey.

Regards
Massimo

There is a description of La5F coloring, including internal surfaces.  Taken from the aircraft dehdocumentation.  why other fantasies?

The inner surfaces could be painted in several ways: two layers of AN Al dope varnish on gray nitro-soil DD-113, two layers of gray oil A-14 (or glyphthalic A-14f of the same color) or one layer of resin varnish No. 1. When repairing aircraft, the inner surfaces  could be covered with a layer of VIAM B-3 glue or two layers of A II Al., AMT-7 or A II aerosol varnishes of light blue color.

found a very interesting photo.  but I'm at a loss - what series?

(https://www.laspace.ru/upload/medialibrary/c6e/c6ebdd588e82e40a54125a9c3d00f524.JPG)

I haven't seen this photo before either,  thanks for sharing.  It's a strange one. It's probably  some experimental (pre. serial production)  plane?  
The tail (rudder) is that of the LaGG-3 and the exhaust flap looks strangely cut off at the top (or rather, the exhaust is further up). The heat protection panel is rectangular like that of the La-5, even though the  experimental LaG-5 (or LaGG-3 with M-82 engine) that I've seen had this panel cut on a diagonal at the back,  similar to the LaGG-3 lines.   This plane doesn't look like a La-5/LaG-5 production series plane,  nor does it look like the pre-production test plane that I've seen.  Puzzling. I am curious to find out more about it also:)

The date on the photo is pretty late  for it to be an 'experimental plane' (Unless they just took the photo quite late).  By the end of August 1942 the first three series of La-5 were already built. I think they moved on to series-04 in September if I am not mistaking.

Hi,
the serial on the fin is readable, it seems 5003. Does this help?


interesting, thank you. This confirms that aluminum was one of the options. it would be interesting to know if there is a chronological succession of these ways of painting, or if was all related to what they had on hand.

I met silver glue only on LaGG-3, and then this machine was flight tests at the Air Force Flight Research Institute or TsAGI.  But we can assume that with both LaGG and Da there could be some deviations from the standard, because at different plants the fields and forms of camouflage were slightly different, both in the early (green-black) and in the later ones (gray-dark gray).  

and I also found the serial number in the photo, but the search has not given any result yet.  A very interesting model, as a colleague noted, in addition to the keel, there are deviations in the location of the exhaust manifold.

Once again, I apologize for my terrible English (

A photo of the cockpit of a LaGG-3 captured by Finns seem to show silver walls too, so I think that it was common.

4-digit serial numbers are characteristic of the plant No. 31. found information on the aircraft of the 31st plant with serial number 5003
Completed - 09/22/42
Transferred - 131 IAP
Downed - 10/26/42
But the photo shows 08/25/42
Either I am going the wrong way, or it will remain a mystery to me ...

Thanks for that info Johann. Yes,  the mystery continues, since the photo was taken almost a month before the airplane with a serial number 5003 was completed, according to the dates you've provided.   Interesting.