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AMT-11 and AMT-12 Controversy
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Author Topic: AMT-11 and AMT-12 Controversy  (Read 81638 times)
Hero Member
Posts: 1783

« Reply #120 on: April 25, 2012, 01:03:15 AM »

We all have to start somewhere, Xan.  To be honest, that's a very nice looking model, except for the greenish WEM AMT-12.  I went out and bought most of WEM's VVS paint set before I realised they were based on questionable research.  I've recently repainted in black/green an La-5 I did a long time ago in brown/green.



"I'll sleep when I'm dead."

- Warren William Zevon
Full Member
Posts: 245

« Reply #121 on: April 26, 2012, 11:22:39 PM »

For me, all those planes were camouflaged according to 1943 NKAP scheme.  As I said:  sometimes corners were rounded, some lines were curved and overspray varied.

It is also posible that some (or most?) of those planes have been repainted in the field.

If it isn't 1943 NKAP scheme, what is it?  "South Front"? Loops?  Serpents?


Konstantin, please don't put EP's words in my mouth (South Front...Loops..Serpents...) -- I'm not intending in any way to bring him into this discussion. I grant that the majority of the planes in the overhead photo adhere reasonably closely to the basic shapes in the 1943 NKAP scheme. However, I'm seeing several planes where the patterns look different enough to be more than just a change in curves or overspray. I'm looking, for example, at the starboard wing of the second plane from the front in the closer line (just to left of overhead plane's shadow) where instead of the wingtip being AMT-11 with a pretty straight left demarcation, the AMT-11 is brought around in almost a circle with AMT-12 between it and the tip. Or another case in point, the port wing of the third plane from the front in the closer line where the AMT-12 area closest to the cockpit is not broken by a "river" of AMT-11 running towards the cockpit, but rather there is an unbroken slanted demarcation between the AMT-12 and the AMT-11 to its left.

I'm not challenging the assertion that camouflage schemes were generally governed by the 1943 NKAP diagram, just noting some what I perceive to be exceptions.

Sr. Member
Posts: 459

« Reply #122 on: May 15, 2012, 09:18:10 AM »

hello , i'm still loocking for colours in gunze or tamiya (with a maximun of two paints to mix)...

for AMT-7, I mixed RLM 65 (H67)80%,  an intermediate blue (H45) 20%:

compare with Akan AMT-7:

it's evidently not blueish enough...

later I mix the RLM 65 to tire black, 70%/30% for the AMT-11 et 50%/50% for the AMT-12

compare with Akan:

here too, it could be more blueish, but i find  the result interesting because we can see the darkness of the colors are quite the same...

I heard about the directiv who says that in case of of AMT11 and 12 paint shortage, AMT-7 and AMT-6 could be mixed
(70%/30% and 50%/50%).
Does someone know more about that notice ? have we the real text, or better  an original document pics?
thank  Wink


Sr. Member
Posts: 459

« Reply #123 on: May 15, 2012, 04:34:32 PM »

Pascal told me Orlov and vakhlamov speak about that in their book, I will have a look tonight..

Massimo Tessitori
Hero Member
Posts: 5999

« Reply #124 on: May 15, 2012, 05:49:43 PM »

Hi Xan,
If I remember well, they write that the thing can be done in case of need, but they don't give the proportions in the booklet. I've seen the proportions on a table of (I think) but I don't know their source. Perhaps it's some article of the same authors on some old M-hobby issue; the booklet resumes many of those works in a briefer form and has removed some interesting info, as the FS matches of the colors.
Russell M
Posts: 9

« Reply #125 on: August 04, 2012, 07:00:04 AM »

I have to say that the Akan paints look much better when applied to a scheme than they do as stand alone chips.  The difference between AMT 11 and AMT 12 is slight when comparing chips but a larger coverage area seems to accentuate the contrast in the 2.  I had been using Model Master Russian Topside Blue for AMT 7 and the percentage mixes with black for the others but will have to reconsider a new substitute and adjust mix some new batches as they now seem light compared to what has been shown here.
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