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Author Topic: I-153 page  (Read 7903 times)
Massimo Tessitori
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« on: October 11, 2011, 09:03:43 PM »

Hi all,
I've uploaded a small page on the I-153, substantially a collection of photos commenting its evolution and painting.
Please, have a look here
http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/i15/i-153/i-153painting/i-153painting.htm
and let me know any suggestion.
In particular, I have found some confusion on the shutter plate in front of the engine, it looks that at least three different types existed, and the fact that it changes its look when the shutters are closed doesn't make things easier.
Another thing: the I-153s with M-63 were distinguishable from those with M-62 for the spinner only, or was there any other visible difference?
Best regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2011, 11:10:26 PM »

What is your reasoning when you say:
Some I-153s built in this period were painted in the green/light blue scheme, but the old silver/grey scheme looks to have applied also on at least some 1940-standard planes, delivered at the end of 1940.

If you reffer to second half of 1940, all new I-153s were factory painted in gren over blue according to May 1940 directive.  Even "photographic evidence" confirms this!  Those green+blue I-153s from your page are all made during this period.  Silver+gray planes were made before the directive... Cool

Cheers,
KL
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2011, 11:27:19 PM »

Hi Konstantin,
I have doubts on this. I don't know the exact date when I-153 M-63 entered production, but considering that only 400 were built, it should be well before June 1940. The photos collected seem to suggest that M-63 powered planes (with spinner) were green, while M-62 were silver/grey. On the other hand, many of the green planes show discontinuity in colors on the undersurfaces, suggesting that the use of grey and silver was continued even after the introduction of green tops.
Maybe further photos could make more light on this association between green and spinner or on disuniformly painted undersurfaces.
Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2011, 11:50:48 PM »

I'll have to check literature, but:
-  Spinner relates to the propeller type, not necessarily to engine.
-  M-63 engine didn't supersede M-62.  Planes with both engines were made parallel.
-  Colour scheme turns out to be the most reliable/quick way to determine when planes were made!!!

There are so many photos of clearly new, factory painted planes in green+blue scheme, mostly armed with RS rockets - planes made for ShAP regiments.

This is again the case when we know that rules/directives existed, even photographic evidence confirms that rules were followed by the factories.  Yet there are doubts that rules were not followed (because those were recommendations only as one author suggests)....
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2011, 10:16:21 PM »

Hi Konstantin,I've had a look to some further dozens of photos, ant it seems that:
all green planes had the spinner and the front plate with 1 or 2 more windows, probaly characteristic of M-63, except two that are without spinner;
none silver/grey plane seen till now has the spinner or the front with additional windows, so they have to be M-62;
only one plane painted in silver and grey, without spinner, is described as an M-63 production setter, but it's on the snow, so it should be at the very beginning of 1941;
many green planes shows undersurfaces with non-uniform colors, so I think that they are not blue, or not completely blue.
It would be good to know more on the date when the type with M-63 was put into production.
Regards
Massimo
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2011, 10:24:39 PM »

Hi,
look how strange...
http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/74594B1538DCDB97E.jpg

and this... is the effect of fire?
http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/39754B1538D9499E5.jpg

This is a rare M-63 without spinner
http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/255154B1538D712772.jpg


look the strut
http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/2799846190E2358ABE.jpg

http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/398147F0EA01CA2FE.jpg

http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/1877147F0EA02509DD.jpg

this looks dotted

http://www.avia-n-aero.ru/coa/_files/photogallery/2683945F6E0C9A440D.jpg





Massimo
« Last Edit: October 12, 2011, 11:05:59 PM by Massimo Tessitori » Logged
KL
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« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2011, 10:52:40 PM »

Alltogether about 3500 I-153s were made from summer 1939 to winter 1940/41, or in about 18 months.
According to Maslov M-63 was installed in only 340-350 planes.  That would be 1,5-2 months of production!
There is a substantial number of (German e-bay) photos showing those factory camouflaged green+blue planes, more like 25-30% of all photographed I-153s.
Photographic evidence better corresponnds with 6 months of production, ie. from June to Dec 1940.

several authors have tryed to relate shape of engine cowling and propeller type with different engines installed in SB bombers.  all those attempts were unsuccesful.  you can not tell engine (M-100, M-100A, M-103, M-105) by the shape of necelle or propeller type!  Same could be applicable to I-153.  Spinner and additional windows obviously didn't relate to M-63 engine...
« Last Edit: October 12, 2011, 11:03:45 PM by KL » Logged
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2011, 02:25:52 PM »

Hi Konstantin,
On the book of Gordon, I read that the M-63 was prone to catastrophic overheating of the supercharger that led to ground both I-153 and I-16 for three months starting with August 1940. Probably the larger and more windows on the lower part of the frontal plate of late I-153 were part of the solution to this problem. So, the number and shape of those windows should be indicative of the engine type.
Perhaps they reverted to the production of M-62 during that months, possibly conserving the plate with more holes and the spinner.
Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2011, 12:38:28 AM »

On the book of Gordon, I read that the M-63 was prone to catastrophic overheating of the supercharger that led to ground both I-153 and I-16 for three months starting with August 1940. Probably the larger and more windows on the lower part of the frontal plate of late I-153 were part of the solution to this problem. So, the number and shape of those windows should be indicative of the engine type.
Perhaps they reverted to the production of M-62 during that months, possibly conserving the plate with more holes and the spinner.

That well could be the reason for low number of I-153 M-63 and for the substantial number of planes with spinners and additional/larger holes.

I am reading a book about Soviet aviation industry - nothing about I-153 M-63, but it does mention that 1940 was a frantic year:  there were plans to double or triple 1939 production, to introduce new modern types, to build new factories etc.  Quantity was everything, a detail like engine type for a plane that was already obsolete probably didn't mean too much.  I-153 was kept in production only to fulfill the quota, before MiG-3 was in full production.

"Green over blue"  scheme was result of May 1940 directive, not a way to distinguish planes with M-63 engine

KL
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2011, 12:43:56 PM »

Hi,
I've had new informations on the M-63 from Alex Ruchkowsky.
He puntualizes that the oil cooler of the M-63 hadn't an air outlet on the left side, but on the undersurface.

I've seen the photos again, and very few planes show this characteristic.
Besides, the front plates with one more window are made for the oil cooler of M-63, but are compatible with the M-62; vice versa, the old fashioned plate was not suitable for M-63.
It's possible that old engine cowling with the side cutout have been utilized on M-63, but there shouldn't be an outlet protruding from it.
Regards
Massimo
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John Thompson
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« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2011, 02:26:43 PM »

It's good to see new information about the I-153 - thank you, Massimo!  Smiley

John
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learstang
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« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2011, 05:46:24 PM »

Massimo, are you going to do colour profiles for the Chaika, such as for standard camouflage and interestingly camouflaged examples?

Regards,

Jason
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KL
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« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2011, 06:33:08 PM »



Musee de l'Air I-153 painted in spurious, non-aviation Fench colours - nothing to do with VVS colours and paints!!!
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2011, 02:26:45 PM »

Hi Jason,
Quote
Massimo, are you going to do colour profiles for the Chaika, such as for standard camouflage and interestingly camouflaged examples?
Perhaps a day... now I want to continue with the photo galleries of many types. They are a good base to trace profiles in a second time.
Hi Konstantin,
Quote
Musee de l'Air I-153 painted in spurious, non-aviation Fench colours - nothing to do with VVS colours and paints!!!
I see... and it's not even the best photo of it.
Regards
Massimo
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2017, 10:14:05 AM »

Hi,
I've updated the page on I-153 with this interesting image from Scalemodels.ru.
http://mig3.sovietwarplanes.com/i15/i-153/i-153painting/i-153painting.htm


A most interesting camouflage is shown on this photo of 'red 552', the number being visible on the fuselage sides.
it looks made with blotches and bands ofat least two colors, probably dark green and black, probably on the base of the original silver/grey livery. The red stars on the upper wing surfaces were deleted. It's possible, but unlikely unlikely that a red star was applied on the rudder, because the plane, despite the new camouflage, was still much visible from above.

Regards
Massimo
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