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Victory marks on Pokryshkin's P-39 "100"
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Author Topic: Victory marks on Pokryshkin's P-39 "100"  (Read 136903 times)
66misos
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« Reply #45 on: September 04, 2012, 05:12:16 PM »

Hi,

although the memoirs are not very reliable, I would add another shortened part of the article from the Suchov?s (pilot in 16 GIAP since May 30, 1943) book Эскадрилья ведет бой about the moment when Pokryshkin's "100" was damaged:
"At noon on August 1st our squadron landed at the field not far from the village with the beautiful name of Lubimoe...
Area of operations ... the river Mius is shallow now, it is hard to see her. And front passes just along the river.
Sultry day is fading. Weather is calm, windless?
Suddenly, our five Il-2 flew at low level, and the sixth one smoking behind them. The plane is literally above us and descending. We clearly see the hole in the left hull and wing. How only did it stay in the air?
Stormovik suddenly hit the ground, makes a few jumps. And then sparking machine guns shots from the Stormovik flew in the direction of our KP, scattered over the dugout (zemlanka) and over the plane standing beside it with the tail number "100".
I hear chirping of jerky gun shots. What is he doing? People standing on the roof of the dugout and on the slope near the plane, rushed in all directions - some fled, some fell on the ground. Stormovik turned to the left, its right wing almost touches the ?100?. Pokryshkin, who was on the wing, was also on the ground in a moment?
Some dark things split off from Stormovik and flew down. Bombs..."


BTW, I did not find any mention about this event in the Pokryshkin's memoirs Небо войны (Sky of War). Angry

However, Igor Zlobin wrote me in the mail:
"? 03.08.1943 P-39N-BE  № 29004 списан при аварии молодым летчиком, врезался в Ил-2 и самолет отправлен в ремонт и в последующем передан в другую часть. Факт аварии молодым летчиком говорит о том, что Покрышкин в августе летал уже на другом самолете. А начало эксплуатации возможно после 10.05!"
Translated:
"P-39N-BE no. 29004 was written off on 3-Aug-1943 after accident when young pilot crashed into it with IL-2 and the aircraft was sent for repair and subsequently transferred to another unit. The fact of the young pilot accident says that Pokryshkin flew already another plane in August. And the beginning of operation is possible after 10-May." Wink

Regards,
     66misos
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KL
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« Reply #46 on: September 04, 2012, 08:25:44 PM »

Hi 66misos,  Smiley

interesting information re Pokrishkin's P-39N № 29004.

Back to Pokrishkin's first P-39D and it's cannon.  There is a confusion on internet sources; according to some all P-39Ds were armed with 20mm cannons.

Few numbers from Wikipedia that may explain the mistery:

-  P-39D-BE - Armament 1 ? 37 mm/1.46 mm cannon (30 rounds), 2 ? .50 in/12.7 mm (200 rpg) and 4 ? wing mounted .30 in/7.62 mm (1,000 rpg) machine guns; 60 Produced, none (0) delivered to Soviet Union.
-  P-39D-1 - production variant fitted with a 20 mm (.79 in) M1 cannon.  336 produced, three (3) delivered to Soviet Union
-  P-39D-2 - production variant with 37 mm (1.46 in) cannon,  158 produced, 105 delivered to Soviet Union
-  P-39D-3 26 conversions from P-39D-1 to Photo Reconnaissance Configuration
-  P-39D-4 11 conversions from P-39D-2 to Photo Reconnaissance Configuration

It's true - most USAF P-39Ds had 20mm cannon.  But, almost all (105 out of 108) VVS P-39Ds had 37mm cannon...
P-39D-2 is interesting; if you subtract Soviet and PR conversions from total production - only 42 remained in US

HTH,
KL    
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 08:27:44 PM by KL » Logged
66misos
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« Reply #47 on: September 05, 2012, 11:41:18 AM »

Hi KL,

as I already wrote P-39D-1 and P-400 were only versions with 20mm cannon in the spinner. All other P-39s had 37mm cannon in the spinner. At least as a standard (e.g.no field modification).

   http://www.airvectors.net/avp39.html:
"Bell manufactured a total of 675 "P-400" Airacobras for export. The French had bought a batch of P-400s in April 1940; the order was taken over by the British after the fall of France... The P-400 was very similar to the P-39D-1, with the 20 millimeter Hispano cannon...
..."Airacobra I", as it (e.g. P-400) was designated in Royal Air Force (RAF) service...
Only a portion of the P-400 order was delivered to the UK, serving for a short time with RAF Number 601 Squadron, "City Of London". The remainder of the batch was shipped to the USSR or was taken in to US Army Air Forces (USAAF) service..."

   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_P-39_Airacobra:
"...Britain ordered 386 P-39Ds (Model 14), with a 20 mm (.79 in), instead of a 37 mm (1.46 in) cannon ...Britain transferred about 200 P-39s to the Soviet Union...
Another 200 examples intended for the RAF were taken up by the USAAF after the attack on Pearl Harbor as the P-400...
The Airacobras already in the UK, along with the remainder of the first batch being built in the US, were sent to the Soviet Air force..."

http://lend-lease.airforce.ru/english/articles/romanenko/p-39/:

Airacobra I aircraft of 19 GIAP (photo from Artem Drabkin collection)


Capt. I. V. Bochkov of the 19th GIAP in front of his P-400 Aircobra I number "16" in East Carelia in 1942.


Still some notes about Pokryshkin's P-39 with or without 20mm cannon in the spinner:

There is a (silver) cap on the spinner top around the 37mm cannon:
 
 
That cap was replaced by cannon cover on the latter versions:
   

or that cap was simply missing:
   

That could explain the big hole on the top of the Pokryshkin's P-39 spinner:

however, unless we clearly see "long barrel" or "short barrel" we cannot deffinitely decide whether it is 20mm or 37mm cannon. We can only say that according to the memoirs (e.g. less probable) it could be 20mm cannon or according to the official papers/documents it should be 37mm cannon (more probable).

Regards,
     66misos




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KL
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« Reply #48 on: September 05, 2012, 06:54:42 PM »



There are absolutely no doubts what type that P-39 behind Pokrishkin was and what cannon it had.  It was P-39D-2 with 37mm cannon.

Quote
"...Britain ordered 386 P-39Ds (Model 14), with a 20 mm (.79 in), instead of a 37 mm (1.46 in) cannon ...Britain transferred about 200 P-39s to the Soviet Union...

Britain transferred 265 Aircobra I to Soviet Union.  54 planes were lost aboard sunken Arctic convoy ships.  Those 211 Aircobra Is and three P-39D-1 were the only VVS Airacobras armed with 20mm cannons.  None of them were used by VVS regiments involved in 1943 Kuban battle.

All Soviet P-39D-2s were supplied by USA.  Some of them even retained ?US ARMY? logo on wing undersides.
P-39D-2s were armed with American 37mm cannons.  VVS regiments equipped with P-39D-2 fought during Kuban battles.  Pokrishkin flew on one of those P-39D-2.

HTH,
KL
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66misos
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« Reply #49 on: September 06, 2012, 12:03:19 PM »

Hi KL,

Quote
as I already wrote P-39D-1 and P-400 were only versions with 20mm cannon in the spinner. All other P-39s had 37mm cannon in the spinner. At least as a standard (e.g.no field modification).

From http://airaces.narod.ru/all2/babak.htm and/or http://www.bellabs.ru/Fotab/I-45-100/P-39_Aerocobra_01.html:





Shortened translation of the text accompanying these photos:
"According to A. Moiseyev (aerial photos decryptor 366 ORAP / 164th OGRAP during WWII) these photos of "Airacobra" - tactical number 40, serial № (4) 1-38416 were probably made in the days of the Air battle of the Kuban..."

Seems that there was at least one Airacobra P-39D-2 that had:
- spinner with big opening/hole for gun,
- long barrel gun in the spinner (e.g. 20mm cannon?),
- propeller blades black with yellow tips,
- propeller spinner not Olive Drab but red,
- red star painted also on the right top wing.

From http://lend-lease.airforce.ru/english/articles/romanenko/p-39/:
"   45th (100th Guards) IAP
...P-39D-2 aircraft (serial numbers 41-38416, 427, 429, 431, 433, 446, 451, 456, 458, and 462)... The regiment fell into the "oven" of combat over the Kuban...
   16th Guards IAP
...11 P-39D-2 (serial numbers 41-38424, 425, 428, 430, 434, 437, 438, 528, 547, 550, and 555)... The regiment began combat operations on 9 April, at the very beginning of the battle for the Kuban..."


When putting those serials into the line: 41-384xx where xx: 16, 24, 25, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 33, 34, 37, 38, 51, 56, 58 and 62, they looks like planes from one or two production series and some similarities are quite possible.
Seems everything is possible. Wink

Regards,
     66misos

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KL
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« Reply #50 on: September 06, 2012, 07:30:44 PM »

When putting those serials into the line: 41-384xx where xx: 16, 24, 25, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 33, 34, 37, 38, 51, 56, 58 and 62, they looks like planes from one or two production series and some similarities are quite possible.
Seems everything is possible
. Wink

If everything was possible, if planes were shuffled without any logic and if field modifications were random, our effort to identify those planes would be hopeless and pointless.  In reality, things were different:  it is logical to keep planes with same armament (i.e. ammunition) within one unit or one battlefield.  Field modifications had had to be approved by a command, usually it went the other way around - there was an order from higher command requesting a modification.

Quote
- spinner with big opening/hole for gun,
- long barrel gun in the spinner (e.g. 20mm cannon?),
- propeller blades black with yellow tips,
- propeller spinner not Olive Drab but red,
- red star painted also on the right top wing

All these are characteristics of the standard P-39D-2
- short spinner with big opening/hole for gun,
- long barrel 37mm gun in the spinner 
- Curtiss Electric propeller with black blades and yellow blade tips,
- propeller spinner possibly "Sky type S" colour,
- red star painted on the right top wing

Following is Fadeyev's P-39D-2 photo and its profiles by Russian artists Bikov and Zolotov






So- it wasn't a 20mm cannon and it wasn't a field modification.  Rather a standard 37mm cannon.

HTH,
KL
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KL
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« Reply #51 on: September 07, 2012, 01:45:44 AM »

It looks I was wrong...  Lips Sealed
According to techn description in "Aerokobri vstupayut v boy", P-39D-2 was armed with 20mm cannon - it was American M-1, a Hispano 20mm cannon licence.

So Pokrishkin and others were right in their memoirs. Pokrishkin's first combat Aircobra had a smaller callibre cannon.

HTH,
KL
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66misos
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« Reply #52 on: September 07, 2012, 12:22:55 PM »

Hi KL,

interesting info regarding 20mm cannons. Only P-39D-x version is still confising.

To better distinguish those cannons I attach pictures of them both.

37mm T9 cannon
The Airacobra was designed around the 37mm T9 cannon (Weight 213 lb (97 kg), Length 89.5 in (2.27 m)). It would be impossible firing through the propeller shaft as could be done with smaller 20mm cannon. Weight, balance and visibility problems meant that the cockpit could not be placed farther back in the fuselage. The propeller was driven via a 10-foot-long (3.0 m) drive shaft running through a tunnel in the cockpit floor and was connected to a gearbox in the nose of the fuselage which, in turn, drove propeller via a short central shaft.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/ctarchives/4522703921/in/photostream/

T9 with 15 round magazine with flexible belt" "37 m/m redesigned as M4E2 w/ combination right & left hand feed mechanism & 15 round magazine


Original M6 magazine 37 m/m M4 (endless belt type) Capacity 30 rounds symmetrically mounted (used on plane P-39)


20 mm (.79 in) Hispano-Suiza HS.404 cannon
Bell Model 14A (P-39D-1 and P-400), production variant fitted with a 20 mm (.79 in) M1 cannon. Specifically ordered for delivery under Lend-Lease.
? Length without muzzle brake: 2.32 m (7 ft 7 in)
? Length with muzzle brake: 2.52 m (8 ft 3 in)
? Weight without drum magazine: 43 kg (94 lb 13 oz)
? Weight (complete): 68.7 kg (151 lb 7 oz)

http://pwencycl.kgbudge.com/H/i/Hispano_20mm_gun.htm



The British Mark 5 and American M3 were shorter and lighter than the original design:


As one can see that:
? 20mm cannon had quite complicated barrel while 37mm cannom had very simple barrel,
? 20mm cannon was longer (with or without muzzle brake) than 37mm cannon,
? weight of 20mm cannon was approxinately half of 37mm cannon weight, plus ammunition,
? 20mm cannon mounted more to front then 37mm cannon (to balance lower weight/center of gravity of P-39, etc.).

So it could be said in general that if "short simple barrel" is going through spinner it should be 37mm cannon and if "something long with complicated barrel" is going through spinner it should be 20mm cannon, as I wrote on August 28, 2012:
Quote
Re: Victory marks on Pokryshkin's P-39 "100"
? Reply #35 on: August 28, 2012, 03:26:00 PM ? Quote Modify Remove  

...37mm cannon through propeller spinner:
            

...37mm cannon usually protected by cover:
            

...20mm cannon through propeller spinner:
            

According to my opinion photo of "40" S/N: 138416 and profile of "37" S/N: 138428 from your last mail show P-39D-x with 20mm cannon.

And with info from your last mail it seems (very) probable that also S/N: 138520 could have 20mm cannon.

It is quite interesting because
? serials 138xxx, e.g. 41-38xxx (P-39D-x) - Fadeev's "37" S/N: 138428, "40" S/N: 138416, "27" S/N: 138555, S/N: 138520 (it had been set aside for the regiment commander who did not fly on combat missions. After 24 April 1943 it was given to pilot P. P. Ketov and safely fought to the end of 1943, setting some kind of record for longevity. A. I. Pokryshkin made a single combat flight in this aircraft in April) - were produced in 1941,
    - are older versions (D1, D2),
    - armed with 20mm cannon (at least some).
? while serials 24xxx, e.g. 42-4xxx -  (Pokryshkin's "13" S/N: 24421 P-39K-1(?), Pokryshkin's "100" S/N: 29004, B.B. Glinka's "1" S/N: 25515 P-39K-1, D.B. Glinka's "21" S/N: 24403 P-39K (type visible on photo), "8" S/N: 24570 - were produced in 1942,
     - they are newer types (ver. K, L, N?),
     - on photos they have "old type" red star with black outline, without (overpained) original blue/white circles under the stars,
     - armed with 37cannon.

According to that Pokryshkin either:
1.) should/could fly P-39D-x, board no. "13"?, S/N: 138xxx, armed with 20mm cannon and memoirs are true regarding his personal switch from weaker to stronger P-39, or
2.) he flew "13" S/N: 24421 P-39K-1 armed with 37mm cannon from beginning and memoirs are true only partially, e.g. not about him personaly but generally weaker planes needed to be replaced by strongers ones. And all that packed within artistic licence into dramatic, but not real event, e.g. that repalcement was not about "13" S/N: 24421 P-39K-1.
Pokryshkin himself in his memoirs Sky of war: "I flew almost all time on the plane with board number 13..."

Regards,
     66misos
« Last Edit: September 10, 2012, 12:53:09 PM by 66misos » Logged

KL
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« Reply #53 on: September 07, 2012, 07:05:21 PM »

Hi 66misos,
yes, you were right regarding the long muzzle cannons on P-39D-2.  It is 20mm M-1.

I tend to rely on information in Romanenko's buks and the picture is very clear:  16 giap initially had a mix of different P-39 types, some armed with 20mm cannons (P-39D-2), some with 37mm cannons (P-39K).  Pokrishkin's first Airacobra (No 13) was P-39K with 37mm cannon



Pokrishkin ocasionally flew other planes, including P-39D-2s.  So the memoirs are not wrong, in this case, kind of misleading...

cheers,
KL 
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66misos
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« Reply #54 on: September 12, 2012, 03:20:49 PM »

Hi,

I appologize for a bit longer post. Wink
I tried to summarize all photos of Pokryshkin with P-39s somehow related to him I found on the internet and frame them by some events from Pokryshkin?s WWII period to better understand historical background when particular aircraft and camo/marking was used. Info and photos are taken from this discussion and from different sources on Internet, all mentioned in previous posts.
All those photos show interesting pattern, if not rule. Pokryshkin is near by the either unidentificable (e.g. his?) aircraft or near by identificable but someone?s else aircraft (Rechkalov, Sukhov etc.).

April 1943    The first Airacobras arrived to 16 GIAP were 11x P-39D-2, 7x Р-39К-1 and 14x P-39L-1. Together with latter deliveries there were:

Serials 41-384xx (P-39D-x)  where xx: 16, 24, 25, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 33, 34, 37, 38, 51, 56, 58 and 62 look like planes from one or two production series and were produced in 1941:
    - are older versions (D1, D2),
    - armed with 20mm cannon (at least some).

Serials 24xxx, e.g. 42-4xxx were produced in 1942,
     - they are newer types (ver. K, L),
     - armed with 37cannon.
Pokryshkin flew mostly P-39K-1(?) "13" S/N: 24421 (42-4421).

Pokryshkin made a single combat flight in elder type S/N: 138520 (41-38520), board no? in April.

Pokryshkin flew also ?130? on 10-Apr-1943 and 17-Apr-1943 according to the ЖБД (журнал боевых действий ? combat book) of the 16 GIAP:


Photos from era before his first HSU Gold Star - no board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane:
         

23-Apr-1943    P-39N-BE S/N: 29004 (42-9004) arrived to 16 GIAP from 25 ZAP.

10-May-1943    P-39K-2-BE S/N: 24421 ?13? or ?130? sent for general maintenance.

24-May-1943   Captain Pokryshkin awarded the Hero of the Soviet Union for the first time.

28-May- 1943,    Pokryshkin flew 41-38520 "17" or ?100?? for a single mission.
                          This plane had been set aside for the regiment commander who did not fly on combat missions.
                          After 24-Apr-1943 it was given to pilot P. P. Ketov and safely fought to the end of 1943.    


Text accompanying the photo: ?Cамолет Покрышкина из киноновостей то ли 42го то ли 43го. Видимо из соображений секретности сняли так что номеров не видно.? ?(Pokryshkin?s aircraft from kino news from year 42/43. To keep in secret photo is made from such angle that no numbers are visible.?
No board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane.

June/Jul? 1943   Pokryshkin promoted to major, having become commanding officer of his squadron.

23-Jun-1943    Pokryshkin exchanged his old P-39K-1  S/N: 24421 (42-4421) "13? for P-39N S/N: 29004 (42-9004), "100".

31-Jun-1943    Division received the order to transfer the Regiment to the Donbass.

3-Aug-1943   P-39N-BE  S/N: 29004 (42-9004) damaged in accident with friendly IL-2,
                          sent for repair & maintenance and latter sent to different unit.

Serial number 29004 (42-9004), board number ?100?:

My observation/opinion:
- Plane is undergoing some repair/maintenance - front fuselage is lift up and supported by construction,
- cover on the left main landing gear is missing,
- manufacturer logo and bright stencils visible on the propeller blades, e.g. bladed should have yellow tips,
- tail tip seems to have different color ( demarcation line is visible) ? red without white line?
Igor Zlobin: ?According to the info from historian Oleg Levchenko and after one month in the archive in the city of Podolsk (CAMO) ? I deleted red tail tips on the planes from period spring-summer of 1943.?  But he kept yellow tips on the propeller blades.
Pokryshkin is not visible somewhere near by this plane.
So, is this still Pokryshkin?s aircraft on this photo or is it already someone?s else when it was repaired after crasch with Il-2 on 3-Aug-1943 and transfered to the other unit?

24-Aug-1943   Major Pokryshkin was awarded the second HSU "Gold Star" medal.

Pokryshkin not at his but Rechkalov?s plane:


September 1943    Pokryshkin flew P-39 (type?) "100" S/N: 219158 ( 42-19158)
 
Screenshot from the doc film about Pokryshkin found on Youtube - S/N: 220136, (42-20136) ?

- No Board Number painted on the fuselage,
- Produced latter than 42-9004 (9004 vs. 20136) and 42-19158 (19158 vs. 20136)
- Although used in the film about Pokryshkin, seems not to be his aircraft.

fall 1943               16 GIAP is based on the Krimean front with the main duty to defend ground troops and ships in the area of Gulf of Sivach.

November  1943   Bad weather conditions limited the air activity, but Pokryshkin started individual flights at low altitude over the Black Sea.

Pokryshkin in front of his Airacobra?

Text in the photo: ?Alexander Pokryshkin (right). 40th years of last century.?
No board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane. Winter 1943/spring 1944?
 
Pokryshkin and D.B. Glinka in front of Airacobra:

No board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane. Winter 1943/spring 1944?
 
K.G. Vishnevetskiy, A.I. Pokryshkin, N.E. Lavitskiy, D.B. Glinka, B.B. Glinka, I.M. Dzusov, I.I. Babak, G.A. Rechkalov:

No board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane. Winter 1943/spring 1944?

end of 1943   Pokryshkin was appointed as commander of 16 GIAP with the rank of Lieutnant Colonel.
                          The 16 GIAP was retired from the front to complete its ranks with new pilots and planes.

7-Nov- 1943    Pokryshkin was in Moscow, proposed to become the commander of the flight school. He refused.

Since Feb-1944   Pokryshkin did not fly nearly as much, he was not allowed to fly because of fear of him getting killed.
                         Pokryshkin spent a lot of time in the radio bunker, directing his regiment's fights over the radio.

May/Jun? 1944    
Pokryshkin returned to the front, he was promoted to colonel and given command of 9th GIAD - Guards Fighter Air Division division
, composed by 16, 100 and 104 GIAP:
Screenshot from the doc film about Pokryshkin found on Youtube:
   
Most of the time he was sitting in a tank with a powerful radio, issuing commands. Pokryshkin was forbidden to perform combat missions, but he sometimes completed successful combat missions with his old unit.
Boris Glinka succeded him as commander of 16 GIAP.

16 July 1944   Pokryshkin shot down two Stukas and one Hs.129.

30 May 1944    Near Yassy, Rumania. Three Ju.87s were shot down by Pokryshkin.

19-Aug-1944   Pokryshkin awarded the Hero of the Soviet Union for the third time.


No board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane.

September 1944.  Pokryshkin in the cockpit of Rechkalov's P-39N S/N: 28747 (42-8747):


14-Jan-1945   Pokryshkin?s last victory was another Ju.87

1945               Stills from 1945 movie taken in Germany.  
                         Pokryshkin is again in Rechkalov?s P-39 and he is again greeted by his pilots. The plane is P-39Q S/N: 42547 (44-2547):
     
In spite of what Pilawskii writes, this second plane had exactly the same markings as the earlier P-39N:  victory stars on its nose and RGA on its fuselage...      
 
Screenshot from the doc film about Pokryshkin found on Youtube:

- P-39 ?15? S/N: 4278xxx (44-278xxx) ?
- Produced in the year 1944,
- Although used in the film about Pokryshkin, not his aircraft.
 
Screenshot from the doc film about Pokryshkin found on Youtube:

- P-39 S/N: xx273 (xx-x273) ?
- Although used in the film about Pokryshkin, not his aircraft.
 
P-39N, 16th GvIAP, ?50?  Pilot - Konstantin Sukhov, Eastern Germany, Spring 1945:

'50' was one of the 16 GIAP's colorful P-39Ns that retained its Buffalo applied white disc. Indeed, it must have done so for quite some time, as Sukhov was photographed piloting this aircraft in eastern Germany during 1945! The aircraft appears to have remained in its delivered condition, save for a red spinner and flash on the fin/rudder, this trimmed in white. Other P-39Qs of this unit demonstrate stars on white discs applied asymmetrically on the wings in the USAAF fashion, and it seems likely that '50' is also so marked.
Using the Autobahn as a runway, flew P-39Q-15 "white 50", Serial Number painted out (originally assigned to K.V. Sukhov).
 
Screenshot from the doc film about Pokryshkin found on Youtube:

- Board Number painted but I cannot see it correctly,
- Although used in the film about Pokryshkin, not his aircraft.
 
Pokryshkin, B.B.Glinka (shot down on 14-Jul-1944, did not fly anymore), Rechkalov, Klubov (died on 1-Nov-1944 in La-7 accident) and some others:

No board and serial number visible, not possible to identify that plane.

Any comments and corrections and photos are more than welcome.
Thank you for your help.
Regards,
    66misos
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 03:36:11 PM by 66misos » Logged

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« Reply #55 on: September 12, 2012, 07:16:45 PM »

Hi 66misos,
very good overview.

more photos for your collection:
Winter 1943/44


Famous Sept 1944 photo

« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 08:01:18 PM by KL » Logged
learstang
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« Reply #56 on: September 12, 2012, 10:03:54 PM »

Konstantin, was that last photograph taken in colour or colourised?

Regards,

Jason
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- Warren William Zevon
KL
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« Reply #57 on: September 12, 2012, 10:56:51 PM »

was that last photograph taken in colour or colourised?

Colourised, of course  Smiley
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learstang
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« Reply #58 on: September 13, 2012, 12:07:14 AM »

was that last photograph taken in colour or colourised?

Colourised, of course  Smiley

I thought so.  Were there any actual colour photographs (or film) of Soviet aircraft taken by the Soviets during the GPW?  The only ones I've seen are German.

Regards,

Jason
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"I'll sleep when I'm dead."

- Warren William Zevon
KL
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Posts: 1678


« Reply #59 on: September 13, 2012, 01:59:31 AM »

I haven't seen them yet.
The first Soviet colour film was "Victory parade" filmed in summer 1945 on captured German films and developed in occupied Germany.
In 1943 Exhibition of captured german war material in Moscow was also filmed in colour -so there is a Soviet colour movie of captured German planes
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