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Author Topic: Corrections for Pilawski's book  (Read 49488 times)
KL
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Posts: 1678


« Reply #105 on: March 01, 2013, 08:12:17 AM »

... the idea that the factories had their own interpretation of the camouflage has a partial truth. I can easily distinguish the factory of production of Il-2s from some details of the photos, including the camo pattern.

What you can do is nice, but it doesn't prove Pilawskii's theory:  Camouflage determined by factories and camouflage interpreted by factories are two very different things.

Pilawskii says that factories devised camouflage schemes.  He says that Zavod 21 started painting I-16s in black-green scheme in 1938!  That Zavod 1 made green-dark green I-153s in 1940!
Pilawskii also writes that Zavods often ignored NKAP orders.  He writes how 1944 La-7s were single gray colored (no camouflage at all).  This teory is fundamentally wrong.

You are saying that there were variations between Zavods in how ordered schemes were executed.  You also know that this was the result of poorly defined patterns (1941 scheme did not define one side, plus there was a requirement to vary patterns)
Do you have any evidence that factories ignored orders and delivered uncamouflaged planes or planes camouflaged in non-standard colours (red-brown, yellow or lime green) during the GPW?

Pilawskii doesn't explain why planes were camouflaged in the first place.  SAFFC readers get an impression that factories switched to camoufalge when they wanted and camouflaged planes how they wanted.
I can't find Pilawskii's two-part Il-2 camouflage treatise, but those who read it got an impression that factories actually competed who will invent more colourfull scheme.  According to Pilawskii camouflage was seen by the factory workers as an expression of their identity!?!?

All this shows that Pilawskii doesn't have a clue how Soviet aviation industry was organized and who was responsible for the camouflage.  He substitutes his lack of knowledge with fiction and fairytales.

Regards,
KL
« Last Edit: March 01, 2013, 06:45:49 PM by KL » Logged
Troy Smith
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Posts: 380


« Reply #106 on: March 02, 2013, 03:46:23 AM »

You guys can't be serious - it's not a good try or a commendable effort, it's a complete crock, and an insult to anyone who's serious about the subject.

 And to think that people will actually read and believe this "Fritz the Fox" person - I hate the Internet...  Angry

John

HI John

I had a quick look at the some of the other sections...  the guy actually makes VVS camo sounds more complex than Luftwaffe camo!!!!

The IS the internet, well, internet generation, have a read

http://www.fritzthefox.com/ww2airplane_guide.html
Quote
If you're like me, you love airplane books. Big, coffee-table-sized, lavishly illustrated books with lots of exciting photos and cutaways to pore over for hours. It's a good thing those books have lots of pictures, too, because they are often dreadfully boring to read. While it may conceivably be helpful to know that the Bf109 was powered by a Daimler-Benz dee-bee-five-oh-whatever producing so many horsepower at such and such an altitude, it certainly isn't light reading. So I took the liberty of preparing a kindler, gentler coffee table book, with all the boring technical bits left out. You don't even need a coffee table! What follows is still packed with information, but presented in an eye-friendly format for your amusement and enlightenment. The format should be easy enough to figure out, but below are a few comments that may provide you some further insights into what it all means...

classic
http://www.fritzthefox.com/building_a_model_airplane.html

It's like asking me to play  soccer, [or any other sport]  and write it up..

also worth a quick squizz
http://www.fritzthefox.com/tenworstplanes.html

including the repated story about the Buffalo... yeah, not the greatest plane in the Pacific, but a bunch of ill prepared US or British Empire flyers against some of the best flyers in the world....

They guy does have a contact address. mailto:[email protected]

the ONE good thing is he does link to sites with real information.  
maybe he needs some emails to add a link here to his VVS fantasies...

The internet is great if you have a brain.  If you have half a brain you might learn.  But it also gives the dim a platform, and there are a lot of them... especially the ones with ADHD who make sites like this...  

erm, slighly off topic..

I never did rant about Pilawskii's 151 wing Hurricane profile with a big grey fusleage repair patch did I....
still this is the an who prefaced his Hurricane fanstaies with
Quote
I have no expertise in the field of RAF camouflage, and whilst working from excellent resource material, I have not undertaken physical studies of these paints nor their properties. The resulting character of the various British paints, and the Soviet ones used to modify their appearance, is therefore theoretical in nature, and represents my own attempt to find the most likely solution which fits the current evidence.
http://vvs.hobbyvista.com/Modeling/Hawker/Hurricane/HurriProfiles/Part1/VVS_Hurricanes-1.html

I can't even begin to to pick my way through that train wreck [or is it worth another posting??] but the 3rd plane in winter camo is not DFS but TLS.... sky undersides show nearly white against snows, not dull grey....

blah, too cranky to be posting, got a cold...

T

PS Jason  - http://www.fritzthefox.com/ww2guide/il2.html

John  - http://www.fritzthefox.com/ww2guide/yak1.html

cutting edge research here...
« Last Edit: March 02, 2013, 04:05:57 AM by Troy Smith » Logged
Massimo Tessitori
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Posts: 5778


« Reply #107 on: March 02, 2013, 12:45:16 PM »

Hi,
I've tried to write to him, but my mail didn't arrive; I don't know if the mail address is invalid or some antispam filter is making its jokes. Anyway, all the site has an humoristic approach, so I don't think that the unaccuracies in this page will fool many modellers.
Regards
Massimo
« Last Edit: March 02, 2013, 05:58:35 PM by Massimo Tessitori » Logged
John Thompson
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Posts: 1498



« Reply #108 on: March 03, 2013, 08:02:06 PM »

Okay, maybe I overreacted - heaven knows, I have no right to call myself an expert on VVS camouflage or to condemn this guy's light-hearted attitude. Modelbuilding is supposed to be fun, after all. Although associations between "Yak" (as in Yakovlev) and "hairy Asian cows" always strike me as really, really lame, no matter how well-intended.

Get well soon, Troy!  Smiley

John
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learstang
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Posts: 1763



WWW
« Reply #109 on: March 03, 2013, 08:21:32 PM »

To be honest, I find his site rather amusing (in a good sense), and reasonably harmless (as long as people realise that this is the site for accurate Soviet schemes!).  At least he doesn't take himself too deadly serious.

Regards,

Jason
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"I'll sleep when I'm dead."

- Warren William Zevon

http://www.learstang.com
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