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Author Topic: P-39 Airacobras in VVS  (Read 70748 times)
66misos
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« Reply #135 on: August 28, 2014, 06:30:31 AM »

Hi,
this is interpretation of "40" on AML Decals http://www.aml.cz/index.php/en/decals-in-1-48-scale/38-amld-48-020
Enlarged picture:


White number 40, no band on the spinner.  Huh Victory stars seems to be red with the white outline. No serial number on the tail.
Regards,
   66misos
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #136 on: August 28, 2014, 07:09:00 AM »

Hi Konstantin,
yes, it helps. Unfortunately I can't understand how hands are. Could it be that she has a small silvery pistol on his left hand?
Hi Misos,
I fear that the AML instructions are wrong on the band and on the color of the number.
Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #137 on: August 29, 2014, 08:43:27 PM »

2 Airacobras which belonged to two squadron commanders of the 69 giap:

Shikunov


and Proshenkov


It is possible that the coloured spinner ring marks squadron: yellow on Shikunov's P-39 and red on Proshenkov's P-39.
HTH,
KL
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66misos
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« Reply #138 on: August 30, 2014, 08:19:27 AM »

Hi KL,
thank for photos, I already know them, but I am I bit confused differences, although the both are from 69 giap:

1.) Shikunov's no. "61"
- (white?) digits 61 are outlined (red?),
- Alexandr Nevski emblem on the door,
- no arrow/lightning on the side.

2.) Proshenkov's no. "46"
- digits 46 do not have apparent outline. Although on the enlarged photo some outline is visible, but it could be also only compression artifacts,
- no Alexandr Nevski emblem ,
- (red) arrow/lightning with (white?) outline

Regards,
     66misos

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KL
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« Reply #139 on: August 31, 2014, 08:30:29 AM »

Hi Misos,
1.) Shikunov's P-39 had number "21"

2.) Shikunov was photographed in 1944, Proshenkov a year later, in spring 1945.

3.) Nevski order, lightning, victory stars and pin-ups are all personal (pilot's) markings

4.) Painted spinner was regimental, tactical marking.

HTH,
KL
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66misos
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« Reply #140 on: August 31, 2014, 10:16:59 AM »

Hi KL,
You are right, Shikunov's P-39 is "21":





I found at http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/102-69giap-online-wargaming-rof-il2-clod/?p=22259 that 69giap was awarded Order of Alexander Nevsky on 26.04.1945 for "For exemplary performance of command assignments in the fighting during the breakthrough of the German defenses and defeat the enemy troops southwest of Oppeln and displaying valor and courage."
Therefore I thought that Alexandr Nevski Medal emblem painted on the door was unit marking/decoration, not personal (pilot's) one. Here is another example, pilot Vasily Ivanovich Tchizh also from 69 giap in front of his P-39:


Regards,
   66misos

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KL
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« Reply #141 on: September 02, 2014, 12:51:33 AM »

Hi Misos,

Therefore I thought that Alexandr Nevski Medal emblem painted on the door was unit marking/decoration, not personal (pilot's) one.

Yes, you are right about the Alexander Nevski Order - Shikunov wasn't awarded with this one.
In this case, Nevski Order emblem is a regimental marking, but not a tactical marking.  It wasn't painted on planes to distinguish them from the planes of other regiments; it was more a decorative element.

KL
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66misos
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« Reply #142 on: September 04, 2014, 06:09:18 AM »

Hi KL,
I realized now, that photo of Shikunov with A.N. emblem painted on his Cobra is dated to 1944 while 69 giap was awarded A.N. on April 1945, at least according to info I found on the net Huh
Regards,
  66misos
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KL
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« Reply #143 on: September 04, 2014, 08:12:07 AM »

Hi Misos,
after all, I was right - A. Nevski emblem was Shikunov's personal marking!   Cheesy

info from wikipedia https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A8%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%83%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%A4%D1%91%D0%B4%D0%BE%D1%80_%D0%98%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

О́рден Алекса́ндра Не́вского - Приказ 5-й ВА № 016/н от 29.04.1944
Погиб 15 марта 1945 года. Похоронен на центральной площади города Бриг (ныне город Бжег, Опольское воеводство Польши).

Cheers,
KL
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66misos
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« Reply #144 on: September 04, 2014, 12:18:16 PM »

Hi KL,
Thanks for clarification.
Hi Misos,
after all, I was right ... Cheesy...
KL
I somehow felt it, therefore I made my previous post Wink
Regards,
    66misos
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KL
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« Reply #145 on: September 04, 2014, 09:20:51 PM »

Hi Misos,
an interesting case!
According to M. Bikov's book, all three 69 giap pilots mentioned in this post (Shikunov, Proshenkov and Chizh) were awarded with A. Nevskii order.  69 giap as a unit was also awarded with same A. Nevskii order.

Shikunov (21+1 victories) was proposed for GSS order, but awarded only in 1998 posthumously!  Proshenkov (19+4 victories) was awarded with GSS order in June 1945.  Chizh ended WWII with 12+1 victories and although he scored 2 more victories in Korea he never became GSS (GSS order was usually awarded for 15 victories during GPW).

Regards,
KL
  
« Last Edit: September 04, 2014, 09:37:12 PM by KL » Logged
KL
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« Reply #146 on: May 29, 2015, 02:06:29 AM »

Photo with Rechkalov and Trud was published in "Ogonek" magazine No 28-29 1944





KL
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66misos
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« Reply #147 on: August 22, 2015, 01:47:29 PM »

Hi,
nice pictures of the "grey" Cobras from 22 giad:

212 giap:




According to the Russian sources it is already after-the-war photo. This Cobra should be of the same grey color as this
Karmin's Cobra from 129 giap, same 22 giad:


Color of this Cobra from 213 giap is questionable:

It is late war Q21-25 version, probably winter 1944/45 at that time VVS already did not use winter camouflage (also not the tail of the next Cobra). It laso does not look like silver "serebrjanka". So most probably some grey. Note the propeller blades - they still have original logo and stencils and they were originally relatively dark:

In this context light blue-grey AMT-11 could be a canditate.

regards,
   66misos
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #148 on: August 22, 2015, 02:30:50 PM »

Interesting photos indeed, a grey Cobra would turn into an interesting profile.  AMT-11 is a likely candidate for uniform grey planes. It depends also on the year of the shot.
I suppose that the photos of n.44 were shot in different time, and that the white band was deleted between the shots. Seems that two thin outlines were still visible.
Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #149 on: August 23, 2015, 07:31:23 PM »


Color of this Cobra from 213 giap is questionable:

It is late war Q21-25 version, probably winter 1944/45 at that time VVS already did not use winter camouflage (also not the tail of the next Cobra). It laso does not look like silver "serebrjanka". So most probably some grey. Note the propeller blades - they still have original logo and stencils and they were originally relatively dark:

Why would they completely overpaint a plane that was made in spring 1944 and which arrived in the regiment in autumn 1944 (maybe even later)Huh

If airplane is really completely overpainted, photo was made after the war: winter 1945/46, maybe even later.  IMHO, this Airacobra looks like it is in the standard postwar overall light blue-gray scheme.  Like overall AMT-16 painted La-9 or Yak-11.

Regards,
KL
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