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"Ivan Kozhedub La-5 & La-7"
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Author Topic: "Ivan Kozhedub La-5 & La-7"  (Read 96711 times)
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #120 on: June 27, 2015, 06:04:55 AM »

Quote
I can't see one different starlet?/?  All 62 starlets looks the same...
the starlet of the medal.

Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #121 on: June 27, 2015, 06:38:22 AM »

Quote
I can't see one different starlet?/?  All 62 starlets looks the same...
the starlet of the medal.



that one is known as a "zolotaya zvezda" medal - "Golden Star Medal"



Regards,
Konstantin
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #122 on: June 27, 2015, 05:06:46 PM »

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that one is known as a "zolotaya zvezda" medal - "Golden Star Medal"
Very interesting. Anyway, I haven't written 'victory starlets'.
Regards
Massimo
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66misos
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« Reply #123 on: June 27, 2015, 05:41:37 PM »

Hi,
here are another screenshots from links posted by KL:





Regards,
   66misos

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KL
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« Reply #124 on: June 27, 2015, 08:33:18 PM »

Thanks Misos,  Smiley Those images are interesting and useful!

one photo more from 1967 Demodedovo Air parade:



two photos from Monino museum taken in 1975






Following photo, from which Pilawskii draws wild conclusions is a poor montage and it's totally irelevant:



Regards,
KL
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KL
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« Reply #125 on: July 14, 2015, 03:54:01 AM »

Pilawskii's 2004 web page about the Kozhedub's La-7 has been mentioned several times in this thread. Like everything else from Pilawskii, text should be taken with "a grain of salt"...  There is some true and relevant information, but it's mixed up with authors fantasies (or misinformation, errors etc.).

Some of those fantasies/misinformation/errors are:

1.   Virtually all of the La-7s produced between November 1944 and February 1945 were completed in a single-colour upper surface scheme of AMT-11.
... We know this to be true not only from the factory records, but also from the anecdotal reports of pilots (like Alelyukhin and Dolgushin) who acquired La-7s from the factories at this time in person, and painted them with their own creations. In that case, "White 27" would have looked like this when delivered to the Regiment.



This is all misinformation:  there is no evidence (Pilawskii hasn't seen any factory records!!!) that any combat fighter plane was finished uncamouflaged in a "single-colour upper surface scheme"  between November 1944 and February 1945.  All series fighters made during this period were camouflaged in 2-gray camouflage scheme.

2.  It seems that "White 27" also passed into the collection of the Zhukovskiy Institute (TsAGI) at this time, and was displayed informally for the students/staff at TsAGI.

This is also misinformation:  what would be the purpose of an wooden piston engined plane at TsAGI shortly after the war?   at that time TsAGI was busy developing subsonic/trans-sonic jet airplanes.

3.  Mystery, Catastrophe or Conspiracy?....   the rumours of mishap are persistent, and credible. Many historians have examined the current La-7 specimen at Monino and found it to be unconvincing. I certainly have been one of these. When I pressed the staff for answers, I began to hear a lot of hushed rumours. The most notable of these came from such persons as the former Director Yakovlevich, who recalled that there was some kind of "accident" involving "White 27" during the 1960s.

There is no conspiracy - Kozhedub's La-7 was moved from TsDAK to Monino Museum in 1960 and it stayed there since.  For some 50 years it was sporting one and the same paint job - dark gray upper surfaces and light blue undersides.

HTH,
KL    
« Last Edit: July 15, 2015, 03:20:10 AM by KL » Logged
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #126 on: July 14, 2015, 12:05:08 PM »

Quote
We know this to be true not only from the factory records, but also from the anecdotal reports of pilots (like Alelyukhin and Dolgushin) who acquired La-7s from the factories at this time in person, and painted them with their own creations.
For what I know (thanks Misos) Dolgushin's plane had grey uppersurfaces, but it was repainted and reprimed at the maintenance depot of his unit. Few other known planes of his unit appear camouflaged on photos.

Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #127 on: July 15, 2015, 03:42:02 AM »


For what I know (thanks Misos) Dolgushin's plane had grey uppersurfaces, but it was repainted and reprimed at the maintenance depot of his unit. Few other known planes of his unit appear camouflaged on photos.

Pilawskii writes about the single-colour upper surface scheme applied in factories during the war, in 1944 and beginning of 1945.  In his SAFFC book, he has described quite a few such schemes  purportedly applied on all kinds of Yak and La fighters.  There is even bluish Yak-9 scheme supposedly representing "wood aeroluck" (whatever that is?).  
Naive readers (including myself...) had an impression that those schemes were based on "factory records".  Now we know that Pilawskii only source were few already published photos.  

Yes, there are photos of Yak and La fighters in single-colour scheme, but those photos show either a relatively small number of overhauled planes or post-war planes.

In short, factory applied single-colour scheme before VE-day is another Pilawskii's fantasy - should be discarded same as his "green-brown scheme" or "south front scheme".
Regards,
KL    
« Last Edit: July 15, 2015, 05:12:00 AM by KL » Logged
Johann
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« Reply #128 on: September 04, 2015, 08:06:08 AM »

As for the numbers, maybe someone will be useful
La 7 №27 early type (and for most it is a photo we see) is the serial number №45210127 (Well, at least that which is preserved in Monino)
So №45210127 number belongs to 21 GAZ (Gorky (Nizhny Novgorod)) And they in turn did a blue piping on the board rooms.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2015, 08:08:50 AM by Johann » Logged
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #129 on: September 06, 2015, 06:11:25 PM »

Hi Johann,
Quote
And they in turn did a blue piping on the board rooms.
Do you mean that there was a blue outline around the bort number?
Regards
Massimo
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Johann
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« Reply #130 on: September 07, 2015, 08:17:24 AM »

Yes exactly. Blue tracings rooms
English I still difficult obschatsya (
« Last Edit: September 07, 2015, 08:20:18 AM by Johann » Logged
steph40
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« Reply #131 on: October 05, 2015, 02:08:00 PM »

Hello,

If I well understood, the most probable scheme of Kozhedub La-7 early in 1945 is this one ?

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1/48 aircraft of the Aces
Johann
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« Reply #132 on: October 05, 2015, 03:09:13 PM »

Yes, just was a white cone screw
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barneybolac
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« Reply #133 on: January 25, 2016, 06:17:56 AM »

Never seen this photo before.

http://nemaloknig.info/read-256208/?page=3

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66misos
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« Reply #134 on: January 25, 2016, 10:11:50 AM »

Hi Barney,
nice photo. Seems to be from the same photo session like this one:

Note the blanket on the engine cowling.
Regards,
    66misos
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