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Author Topic: DB-3 / DB-3F / Il-4  (Read 8097 times)
66misos
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« on: March 27, 2017, 08:49:03 AM »

Hi,
I started work on DB-3 profile. It should be this plane:

More at http://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/db3-il4/tapanidb3/db-11story.htm

At this photo:

it looks like prop. spinner and propably also front ring at engine cowling are not painted in silver.

Here http://www.xliby.ru/transport_i_aviacija/istorija_aviacii_2001_02/p3.php they write (in Russian) that plane on photo above belonged to 53 dbap.
This is "usual" profile of the another DB-3 from 53 dbap, airport Puskin, December 1939-January 1941:


On the first photo of " Red 15" above all red stars are overpainted, but trimer on the rudder is same dark as the fuselage band:

"Red 3" - red is almost black on the bw photo:


"Red 12" - red is almost black on the bw photo:


So questions are:
- fuselage band was black or red?
- spinner is yellow or originally red and now overpained silver?
- front ring of the engine cowling is different metal or yellow...?

Regards,
   66misos
« Last Edit: April 04, 2017, 10:26:30 PM by 66misos » Logged

Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2017, 12:09:37 PM »

Hi Misos,

I guess that the band was black and the trim tabs red.



I suppose that the engine rings, and perhaps the wing leading edge, were repainted grey AE-9 because of their wearing. The prop blades were aluminium with part of the back black, worn on the tips. About the spinner, I think that it was silver or light grey.

Regards
Massimo
« Last Edit: March 27, 2017, 03:03:50 PM by Massimo Tessitori » Logged
66misos
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Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.


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« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2017, 09:38:28 PM »

Hi Massimo,
thank you for reply. It was probably as you wrote. So no yellow but light grey spinner, same as front ring on the cowling. Black fuselage band and red trims on the tail.
Here is ready vector picture:

Now I am going to pain" it, make shadows, reflections etc. I am curious how silver finish will turn out. As I remember coloring Il-2 it was really challengng.
Regards,
   66misos
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2017, 01:47:13 PM »

Hi Misos,
I think that metallic surfaces are characterized by their reflections on shadowed surfaces too, besides the outlines should be scarcely reflective even if in full light. Perhaps, adding noise could help to improve the metallic look.
Regards
Massimo
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66misos
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« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2017, 10:14:18 PM »

Hi Massimo,

I "fight" with "serebrjanka" surface now.

Regards,
   66misos
« Last Edit: March 30, 2017, 09:05:35 PM by 66misos » Logged

Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2017, 06:02:40 AM »

Hi Misos,
the upper part looks good, I would add some reflections from the ground on the lower part. Usually they show a yellowish shade instead of the white-blue shades of the upper surfaces.
Regards
Massimo
« Last Edit: March 30, 2017, 11:16:34 AM by Massimo Tessitori » Logged
66misos
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« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2017, 09:08:59 PM »

Hi Massimo,

thank you for comment. Serbrajanka is basicaly matt (although refflective), it is not like a chrome. So I did not put there apparent ground reflections, I put there more different shadows and light reflections.
EDIT - WIP deleted.
Next one is DB-3F.

Regards,
   66misos
« Last Edit: March 31, 2017, 07:58:33 PM by 66misos » Logged

Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2017, 06:57:47 AM »

Hi Misos,
looks good, only the part of the fuselage around the star looks to have flat sides. If I remember well, the section was oval. So, some ghange in shade in this area could improve the effect.
The engine cowlings are not distinguishable from the fuselage, but they should be grey. I suggest to mke them more uniform and now with a dark part on their upper profile. Besides the light spot should be extended to all the length of the cylindrical part, now it seems stronger on the first half.
I would also make a light reflection line on the fillet of the fin, covering the upper part of the dark one.
Regards
Massimo
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66misos
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Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.


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« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2017, 06:57:22 PM »

Hi Massimo,
thank you for comments. I corrected the profile according to your remarks. Different color is the spinner and only a front part of the cowings.

EDIT: WIP deleted, see next posts in this thread.

Regards,
   66misos
« Last Edit: April 02, 2017, 11:24:55 AM by 66misos » Logged

AC26
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« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2017, 07:22:17 PM »

Hi all,

There are quite many hi-quality pictures of this plane in Finnish publications in addition to those on Massimo's page. Just to name two: Keskinen - Stenman Venäläiset pommittajat/Soviet Bombers and Geuast Red Stars vol 7. Based on them I engine nacelles and spinners are silver as they have similar shine than rest of the airframe.

Cheers,

AaCee
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2017, 07:43:21 PM »

Hi AC,
do these photos show the plane before the application of the Finnish marks? 
I have photos where the plane is all silver, but with Finnish marks. It could have been completely repainted.
Anyway, I am sure that the plane was built with silver cowlings and was so when it entered service, then the grey repainting could have been made simply for maintenance.
Regards
Massimo
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AC26
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« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2017, 07:51:36 PM »

do these photos show the plane before the application of the Finnish marks?
Hi Massimo,

Yes they are. I was also thinking about complete over painting for Finnish livery as it looks too uniform for only partial fixing.

Cheers,

AaCee
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66misos
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Posts: 1512

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.


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« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2017, 07:55:34 PM »

Hi,
at these photos, here still with red star on the underwing:

and here with red star already overpainted:

spinner and front part of the cowling have apparently other shade of grey and level of reflection than rest of the cowling.
Regards,
   66misos

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AC26
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« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2017, 08:30:51 PM »

Hi Misos,

There is a type picture walk around of the ex-15 taken at VL Tampere factory. Maybe close to ten pictures with a close up from engines and nose. Your top picture is one of them. The red star is retouched to your image. They are taken in better lightning than the second one with a Fokker D.XXI on the background.

Another copy of the first one: http://yle.fi/uutiset/3-5709103 Also a story how it was captured.

Cheers,

AaCee
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KL
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« Reply #14 on: April 01, 2017, 12:14:54 AM »

Hi Misos,
your profile looks too gray, to me it looks like really convincing AE-9.
"Serebryanka" is not mirror-like reflective, but it is more reflective than white, and much more reflective than light gray.



Serbrajanka is basicaly matt (although refflective), it is not like a chrome

Serebryanka is not matt. I would say it's "semi-gloss", especially for the scale of your drawings. Check here for names for different sheen values: there are several grades between high glossy and matt.


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