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Clear Prop 1/72 La-5 (Early); Late version Released 11/2020
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Author Topic: Clear Prop 1/72 La-5 (Early); Late version Released 11/2020  (Read 9625 times)
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2021, 10:19:33 PM »

I remember that this thing was discussed years ago on the base of the drawings of... I don't remember, it's the same book with the detailed drawings of LaGG-3 and MiG-3.
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John Thompson
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« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2021, 02:37:19 AM »

It was Soviet Fighters of the Great Patriotic War: MiG-3, LaGG-3, La-5  by V. Voronin and P. Kolesnikov; the page on this topic is here:
https://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/cowling/cowling.html

I remember having a discussion on the forum about this, but I can't find it.

Correct me please if I'm wrong, but I believe the cowlings of the La-5 and La-5F were tapered/bulged/onion-shaped, while the cowling of the La-5FN was straight, like the La-7 (in other words, the sides were parallel). This is also what is shown in the drawings in the MBI La-5 book. I've built the Clear Prop La-5 (early), and the cowling sides are straight, as Dimitri says. I've also built the KP 1/72 La-5. and on that kit, the cowling is very slightly bulged, matching the MBI drawings, although you have to look carefully to see it. It's not quite as visible as it is in the drawings by Voronin.

And what about the LaG-5, which I believe was built in very small numbers by converting stored LaGG-3 series 35 airframes by finishing them with ASh-82 engines? When the Clear Prop (early) kit first appeared, I thought maybe it represented this.

John
« Last Edit: February 11, 2021, 03:24:54 AM by John Thompson » Logged
learstang
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« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2021, 07:59:22 AM »

John, the early razorback La-5s were apparently initially referred to as the LaGG-5 or LaG-5. These had the rounded windscreens and the bulged tail wheel doors, and were converted LaGG-3 airframes. The sources I've read seem to confirm this. The Clear Prop early La-5 kit has the correct rounded windscreen and bulged tail wheel doors for this version. I have to admit that sometimes the bit about how much the cowlings might or might have been bulged is much ado about nothing. I've looked at hundreds of La-5/-5F/-5FN/-7 photographs and that particular feature never jumps out at me. I'm not saying it wasn't bulged on some versions/aircraft, but it is not very apparent, at least not to me, and something I don't worry about. The Clear Prop early La-5 looks like a very nice kit to me (as does the KP La-5 razorback).

Regards,

Jason
« Last Edit: February 11, 2021, 08:04:25 AM by learstang » Logged

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John Thompson
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« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2021, 03:34:00 PM »

Thank you, Jason. I was of the belief that the LaGG-5 (or whatever) was built in very limited production to complete some stored LaGG-3s for which Klimov VK-105 engines weren't available. This is mentioned briefly in Gunston's Osprey Encyclopedia. My impression was that the cowling and panels behind the cowling used to blend the wider radial engine to the narrow LaGG-3 fuselage were very different from the early La-5; maybe I'm thinking of the Gudkov Gu-82 regarding the cowling and panels?

Re the choice between Clear Prop and KP, they're both much better kits of these aircraft than we had before they were released; my preference is starting to lean toward the KP ones. I haven't taken the time to check what's being said on Scalemodels.ru yet.

John
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Psy06
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« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2021, 05:58:58 PM »

It was Soviet Fighters of the Great Patriotic War: MiG-3, LaGG-3, La-5  by V. Voronin and P. Kolesnikov; the page on this topic is here:
https://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/la5/cowling/cowling.html

I remember having a discussion on the forum about this, but I can't find it.

Correct me please if I'm wrong, but I believe the cowlings of the La-5 and La-5F were tapered/bulged/onion-shaped, while the cowling of the La-5FN was straight, like the La-7 (in other words, the sides were parallel).



The trouble with modern model developments is that, very often, accuracy and authenticity are replaced by external beauty for someone who is not familiar with the subject. New models are qualitatively shed, with a lot of details, but with accuracy they have massive trouble ...

Just recently I saw in the Facebook feed, a guy boasted about a set of mods for Trumpeter's Mig-3, spent a lot of money, I looked and was amazed that the expensive resin of the interior was more wrong than the simple, but at the same time neat Trumpeter's castings.

Yes, John, on the Gu-82, the entire 'power-egg' from an M-82-equipped Su-2 was basically 'tacked' onto the front of a LaGG-3.

Jason, it is mistake.
Gudkov has nothing to do with Sukhoi. The Sukhoi motor unit is used on the Pe-8, and this is easy to check, they are exactly the same in key points.

Presumably, the legs of the La-5 motor installation are still growing from relations with the Polikarpov Design Bureau. There was such a situation that Polikarpov began distributing documentation for the I-185 m82 to literally almost everyone, including Gudkov at the 301st plant.

- On July 7, Polikarpov received a letter from the Deputy Head of the 7th Main Directorate of the NKAP G.P. Leshukova:
For the second time, you are invited to urgently print and send to the address of the chief designer of the plant No. 301 com. Gudkov, one set of drawings for the engine cowlings, propeller group and special equipment of the I-185 aircraft with the M-82A engine.
According to the instructions by phone from Comrade Leshukov, the cowlings drawings should be sent to plant No. 301 urgently. 8/07 N. Polikarpov.

Massimo, board broke.  I cant post any new post, and because it, modify old post.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2021, 06:44:00 PM by Psy06 » Logged
learstang
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« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2021, 06:16:41 PM »

Yes, John, on the Gu-82, the entire 'power-egg' from an M-82-equipped Su-2 was basically 'tacked' onto the front of a LaGG-3. It apparently wasn't a particularly 'neat' installation. All the La-5s, even the ones converted from the redundant LaGG-3 airframes, had the M-82s carefully faired in, with the fairing built up on top of the original structure. It's been a while since I wrote my book on the Lavochkin fighters, but I believe the only external difference between the early La-5s (or LaG-5s) and the later, purpose-built razorback La-5s, was the windscreen, the tail wheel doors, and the landing light on the port wing. Regarding the kits, it seems to be another case of you wait for the bus for an hour, and two show up at once. The KP kit does have more interior detail than the Clear Prop kit, but they both appear to be very nice kits. To think we now get to choose between different early La-5s! (Or not; I went ahead and bought both.) Now we can only hope they turn their attention to the LaGG-3. It wouldn't be too hard - to turn an early razorback La-5 into a LaGG-3 series 35 all you need is a different front fuselage, just like on the full-sized aircraft.

Best Regards,

Jason

« Last Edit: February 11, 2021, 10:00:31 PM by learstang » Logged

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John Thompson
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« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2021, 08:12:52 PM »

Thank you for your answers, Psy and Jason! By now I should know all this...  Huh

Jason - I believe Clear Prop are already working on a 1/72 LaGG-3 series 66 for release sometime this year. Originally it was supposed to be late 2020, but COVID delayed their plans.

John
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learstang
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« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2021, 09:58:12 PM »

You're welcome John, and excellent news indeed on the LaGG-3! I shall be looking for it!

Regards,

Jason
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2021, 07:20:21 AM »

Hi all,
I've up-powered the database, this type of interruption shouldn't repeat any more. Years ago, this required payment, now they offered the upgrade for free.
Quote

I am surprised that the photo of the La-7 here seems to show an even more curved profile than the La-5.

Regards
Massimo
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Psy06
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« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2021, 07:32:41 AM »

Hi all,
I've up-powered the database, this type of interruption shouldn't repeat any more. Years ago, this required payment, now they offered the upgrade for free.
Quote

I am surprised that the photo of the La-7 here seems to show an even more curved profile than the La-5.

Regards
Massimo
Massimo, in fact, there is a transverse frame in the area of the nose, where cowlings are closed and there are locking locks. Many high-quality photos show a large dent in this area. Simply put, the nose contours of the la-5 were in reality distorted due to poor-quality production and inaccurate handling during operation.
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John Thompson
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« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2021, 02:41:01 PM »

Is the aircraft on the right an actual La-7, or is it the La-7 prototype, converted from a La-5FN (serial No.39210206)? If it is the prototype, that might explain the bulged cowling.

John
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Psy06
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« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2021, 03:31:28 PM »

Is the aircraft on the right an actual La-7, or is it the La-7 prototype, converted from a La-5FN (serial No.39210206)? If it is the prototype, that might explain the bulged cowling.

John

A set of genuine factory theoretical drawings is available on la7, therefore this aspect is not disputed in any form.

Here you can see that the cowling is not a cylinder

« Last Edit: February 12, 2021, 03:35:53 PM by Psy06 » Logged
John Thompson
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« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2021, 04:02:34 PM »

Thank you, Psy! That's very interesting - the curvature is very subtle, but it is visible. Until today, I believed the La-7 cowling was straight. That makes the Eduard 1/72 La-7 kit incorrect in this regard, although easily corrected. Cheers;

John
« Last Edit: February 12, 2021, 04:27:49 PM by John Thompson » Logged
John Thompson
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« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2021, 08:19:45 PM »

How about this image:



It's a bit big (sorry!) but I think it shows the slight curvature of the cowling as well as possible.

John

« Last Edit: February 12, 2021, 08:21:25 PM by John Thompson » Logged
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2021, 08:45:38 PM »

Hi,
Quote
Massimo, in fact, there is a transverse frame in the area of the nose, where cowlings are closed and there are locking locks. Many high-quality photos show a large dent in this area. Simply put, the nose contours of the la-5 were in reality distorted due to poor-quality production and inaccurate handling during operation.
So, was the curvature  due to the bending between the central dent and the fasteners?
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