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Author Topic: Series of MiG-3 Photos on ebay.de  (Read 6335 times)
John Thompson
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« on: March 12, 2011, 02:22:57 AM »

Go here and scroll down:
http://cgi.ebay.de/27x-Fotos-MIG-3-Russen-Flugzeug-Bucker-181-BRUCH-/170612232685?pt=Militaria&hash=item27b94811ed

Approximately 10 photos of a wrecked MiG-3 taken from different angles or while being loaded onto a truck for disposal.

Also, scroll past the Bucker 181 for two shots of I-16 landing gear wreckage.

John
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2011, 05:41:17 PM »

Hi John,
really sharp photos, they looks made by a true photographer.
Thank you for sharing.
Massimo
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warhawk
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« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2011, 09:15:54 AM »

I hate to see one of my favorite fighters in this state...  Lips Sealed

Anyway, thanks for sharing, superb photos!
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learstang
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« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2011, 04:45:15 PM »

Warhawk, I know what you mean.  Despite their historical (and modelling) significance, I don't particularly enjoy seeing pictures of wrecked IL-2's, especially with some soldiers clowning around on them like it's all just one big party.

Regards,

Jason
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JP
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« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2011, 05:13:24 PM »

Historical context, lads, historical context.  At the time, it was one big party.

I almost cry when I see images of all those beautiful warbirds being chopped up after the war - on all sides. 
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learstang
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« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2011, 10:29:27 PM »

That's a good point, JP.  These were young men after all.  However, I do notice as the war progressed there was no more clowning around on those silly Soviet 'planes they had shot down.  Party over.  I agree with the sadness of seeing all those 'planes being chopped up after the war - it was necessary, but sad nonetheless.  Rows of B-26 Marauders sitting on their tails because the engines had been removed.  What's amazing about the Soviets is that I believe not a single Shturmovik was set aside for preservation - not a one.

Regards,

Jason
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John Thompson
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« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2011, 11:05:57 PM »

I always believe that kind of photo is useful because it shows the internal structure of the aircraft. However, here's a good shot of an I-153 with no visible damage which I just found today; consider this my apology! Wink



It has the "circle in star" insignia; it seems to be painted in AE-9 and AII Al, although the fabric-covered areas of the fin and rudder look darker than the fuselage - more AE-9?

Compare it to this, which is supposed to be the "standard":



John
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 11:10:24 PM by John Thompson » Logged
learstang
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« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2011, 03:16:22 AM »

You're correct about the utility of photographs of damaged aircraft, John.  I've learned a lot about the internal layout of the Shturmovik not just from "Barbarossa Victim" photographs, but also recent pictures of wrecks.  I agree that that I-153 appears to have AE-9 on the fin and rudder.  Those crafty commies, they did things like that just to confuse us bourgeoisie modellers.

Regards,

Jason
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Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2011, 08:24:54 AM »

Hi John,
thank you for sharing this good image.
I often wonder if the color of the fabric could be AII grey instead of aluminium, at least on some planes. I know that they are different, but only few photos show really some metallic shining on the rear fuselage.
Regards
Massimo
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John Thompson
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« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2011, 04:21:47 PM »

On the subject of vandalized aircraft, some may remember this, my favourite I-16, from another thread; here it is early in its captivity, still looking clean and even ready to fly:



The other day I found yet another image (I've got 13, so far) of the same I-16; sadly, the souvenir hunters have been here:



By the way, this aircraft is one of the decal options on one of the reissues of Amodel's 1/72 I-16, although I think their choices for colours, including the numeral 1 on the rudder, are possibly incorrect.

John
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learstang
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« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2011, 04:57:43 PM »

It's strange how the exhaust stains stop at the rear edge of the cowling - I wonder if the fuselage was very recently repainted before capture?  It's a strange effect and if I saw it on a model, absent photographic evidence, I'd think the modeller had made a mistake.  It's possible that some of that dark "stain" might actually be black paint, to hide the exhaust stains, but some of it does indeed appear to be from the exhausts.

Regards,

Jason
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KL
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« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2011, 06:20:29 PM »



It has the "circle in star" insignia; it seems to be painted in AE-9 and AII Al, although the fabric-covered areas of the fin and rudder look darker than the fuselage - more AE-9?

... I agree that that I-153 appears to have AE-9 on the fin and rudder.  Those crafty commies, they did things like that just to confuse us bourgeoisie modellers.

I can?t believe it!!!  Shocked
Two first line players and they both stumbled on basics!!!  Sad

Oil paint AE-9 - for metal only!  For fabric - nitrocellulose paints only!!!

Nitrocellulose varnishes stretched fabric and increased its strength.  Four layers of clear AI-N were optimal.  Number of layers increased, and in 1940 four layers of AI-N were followed with a coat of AII Al (to reflect UV light and protect fabric) and two coats of AII Z (camouflage colour).

If you believe that tailfin and ruder were gray, it was AII Gray.

Hope this helps.  Smiley
KL
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KL
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« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2011, 06:31:07 PM »

Hi John,  Smiley
thanks for sharing those photos!





The fuselage is lighter than cowling on the first picture and the cowling is lighter than fuselage on the second.  Fuselage of first I-16 looks metallic and second looks gray.  IMHO, It's all about the lighting conditions.

I believe that the plain was in its original 1937 colours when captured in 1941:  silver AII Al fuselage and light gray AE-9 metal parts.

Cheers,  Cool
KL
« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 06:38:15 PM by KL » Logged
Massimo Tessitori
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« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2011, 08:53:34 PM »

Hi all,
nice photos indeed.
Jason, I see exhaust stains on the landing gear doors only.
About the sides, I suppose they were washed, or perhaps the airflow from the gap behind the cowling gave some protections against smoke. To tell the truth, I don't remember to have seen many I-16s with stain on their sides.
Regards
Massimo
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KL
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« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2011, 09:32:44 PM »

...some soldiers clowning around on them like it's all just one big party.


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